This calm and considered approach says "Obama" all over it. No panic, but careful consideration of an issue based upon the best available information. It is nice to have an adult in charge of the cheque book again.\ He will not be bullied or intimidated into incautious action.
AdmNaismith
· 1 year ago
Any new money should be contingent on added safety, fuel efficiency, and reduced emissions. no auto maker sould be allowed to produce more than one model of SUV (with sedan fuel standards), and two models of PU (compact & heavy duty). Why they all make dozens of duplicate models is beyond me, and just poor business.
Plus, no bonuses or golden parachutes, and all upper-management works for $1 a year for the next 10 years to fix this.
RIPWAMU
· 1 year ago
Some good points but a bit unrealistic. Would you work for $1 a year?
AdmNaismith
· 1 year ago
Well, no I wouldn't work for $1 a year, but I don't already have a million+ dollars.
-- Adam D. Sperry, C.A.S. N. Hollywood, CA, USA 818 982 8105
lucky hussein
· 1 year ago
Why are waiting for them to present a plan? It we're going to save it, then we own it. Let US make a plan and start taking names. This calls for leadership - guess we have to wait until Jan for that? How about ravi batra's plan? Buy out GM - market cap 1.7 billion - and give it to the workers as a loan. Let them run things for a change. Guarantee the first thing would be: sell the corp jets. GM execs are worthless, why do we think they will come up with a plan?
That is a one sided documentary. There were many other factors involved. By all means read it, but find the other side of the story as well
voicewithin
· 1 year ago
Congress the message you are sending the world has cost more than a trillion dollars. While you are spatting with each other about loaning the big 3 25 billion the American stock markets looses 40 TIMES the 25 billion you are arguing over.
Your actions are playing ping pong with the stock market! Blunders! 25 billion is nothing in comparison to the damage you are causing.
So, what was the rush with the bank bastards? They are the guys that wanted a bailout "no strings attached" - at least the auto industry says it's a "loan". First and foremost, everyone needs to agree to either let go of all the CEOs and/or get them to pay back their bonuses. The board of directors that agreed to the compensation packages for these guys should be hung out to dry - and Greenspan should be doing time. Let the auto industry go down the tube and the guys with the sweetheart deals will be living the good life and the little guy will be out of work and paying the tab.
Griffon
· 1 year ago
American auto manufacturers have been producing a consistently poor product for years. Comparing recalls from Ford (avg. 10-15) and Honda/Toyota (avg.1-3) back in 2006 should have been a whopping red alert to American companies.
Part of this bailout offer should include, as was noted in a WSJ editorial, that the very executives who flew private jets to Washington should be summarily fired along with their executive teams. Their jets sold as a good faith gesture, the money paid into the bailout total.
However, Washington rarely operates on the basis of what is right, but what is leveraged against the policy and who stands to gain the most.
More wads of chewing gum mashed into the dike....
RIPWAMU
· 1 year ago
And who would buy a jet in these times? Who could get a loan?
Griffon
· 1 year ago
I hear Sarah Palin knows how to sell a jet!
*rimshot*
james k. sayre
· 1 year ago
Randi Rhodes, Nova-M radio talk show host, just suggested that Senator Sessions (R-AL) is trying to protect foreign auto manufacturers in Alabama. These include Japanese, Korean and German car manufacturers. Nice to see Republicans standing up for American jobs. With our automobile manufacturing facilities being outsourced overseas, how will be able to make tanks in time of war? Oh, the Chinese will be happy to make tanks for us, when we are confronting them (the Chinese)… End of Republican fairy tales…
Alabama has been giving millions in tax benefits to these foreign automobile manufacturers.
MyVoice
· 1 year ago
They are foreign auto assemblers in the southern States and the profits are sent out of Country. The GOP wants to bust the UAW and this is the weapon they need.
scottinsf
· 1 year ago
Not just southern states. The Toyota Tacoma is built here in the San Francisco area. Of course the plant has been laying people off left and right.
RIPWAMU
· 1 year ago
How do we never hear about tha? Only the imports doing so well and the Big 3 being losers. They are in almost as much trouble as us.
RIPWAMU
· 1 year ago
Yep. Already fired off an email to Shelby. Let us not forget that Birmingham is on the brink of bankruptcy over a water treatment facility. I demand that the foreign companies repay all tax benefits. We also must demand fair trade, not free trade.
We won't be able to make tanks or other artillery. Maybe not even aircraft. We will have it imported and can you imagine the security risks?
MyVoice
· 1 year ago
With 2 trillion in secret loans and 250 of the 700 billion bailout the market should be in better shape than it is in. It is unbelievable to think that after that amount of money these investors are still waiting for more. Barney Franks was funny when he stated the what the next days headlines and news would be if they gave a quick bailout!
MaudGonne
· 1 year ago
Amid another huge increase in U.S. jobless claims, the White House said Thursday it now supports an extension of unemployment benefits. “Because of the tight job market, the President believes it would be appropriate to further extend unemployment benefits, and he would sign the legislation now pending in Congress,” White House spokeswoman Dana Perino said. http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2008/11/20/white...
With all the GOP figuring out how to get welfare, can W get unemployment compensation?
Leroy
· 1 year ago
They can start by getting rid of the greedy UAW.
nicho
· 1 year ago
Right -- so the automakers can make people work for $6 an hour with no health care, while execs get $45 million bonuses. Yeah -- that makes sense.
Let's get rid of the greedy managers first and the other problems will resolve themselves.
RepubAnon
· 1 year ago
Outsourcing the executive suite would definitely be a good start - Tata Motors executives would work for much less and do a far better job. Of course, GM's execs have George W Bush-level skills, so a drunken monkey could do a better job, too.
nicho
· 1 year ago
If I go to the bank to ask for a business loan, they want to see a business plan that shows them how I'm going to spend the money and so they can decide whether it's worthwhile or whether -- like some internet startup kiddies in the '90s -- I'm going to blow it on toys.
Why shouldn't the auto makers be required to tell us exactly how they plan to spend the money?
And, if the goal is to really "save jobs," we should demand that two-thirds of the directors of the the auto companies be from the unions. And, no money until that happens.
BobC562
· 1 year ago
Just wonder if, after being grilled about flying their private jets from Detroit to D.C., they'll be flying coach when they return in a couple of weeks...
Mr Blifil
· 1 year ago
"Wall Street" is merely worried that labor will be included as a beneficiary of government monies. This, they fear, will lead to increased influence on the part of labor, and less money in the form of corporate slush funds to dole out at bonus time to hatchet men with no souls who've done nothing to earn such bonuses.
"Wall Street" knows that including labor at the table means the days of cooking the books and fucking over the work force are coming to a close, and that profit reports will be harder and harder to lie about and fake. This will lead to the rise of investors with genuine acumen, as opposed to those with untrammeled greed. The meritocracy will be making the killings while the idiots suffer the losses, which would be an historic precedent, to say the least.
cheetos
· 1 year ago
Suzie Orman says she's shocked that congress is delaying this and she's worried that whatever is eventually decided might come too late.
RepubAnon
· 1 year ago
Of course the markets panicked when they heard the Congressional ATM said "give us a business plan." See, if Congress hands out money with no questions asked - they can shift responsibility for all Wall Street's gambling debts to the taxpayers more easily.
If that isn't happening, it spooks Wall Street and the banks.
Andrew
· 1 year ago
it won't make any difference to the overall economy here or anywhere else in the world if we save the car makers or not and the reasons are numerous. 1. The American consumer is tapped out having exhausted their credit lines from having used thier homes as ATM machines. So just where are the masses of people going to come from to buy Detroits cars?
2. Many can't even afford to stay in their homes. Foreclosures are the highest in history.
3. Detroit was behind the curve for the last twenty years. They kept building larger and faster cars thinking the party would never end when in fact quality control suffered which is why many began to purchase foreign imports.
4. Innovation seemed to be the last thing on Detroits mind while not realizing or at the least listening to the growing concerns from outside the US at first regarding the enviornment.
5. Yeah they'll be back with a plan, but reality dictates that innovation, technological upgrades and moving to alternative forms of energy for cars and trucks won't happen overnight. Waggoner from GM is pinning his hopes on the Chevy Volt, but is the first to admit that the car is two years off and will cost at least $40,000.
6. 25 Billion would be a drop in the ocean compared to what these companies will require to get through. Have we not learned anything from the AIG bailout that was to cost 85 Billion and now has eclipsed 170 billion? It would make far more sense for the car manufacturers to reorganize through a chapter 11 while looking to develop strategic alliances with the Japanese and others to produce cars that can run on alternative fules. As I have said before here, the Japanese have already invented a car that can run on water. The Indians with Tata Motors have cars that can run on compressed air. It can be done, but it's going to take time and a hell of a lot more than 25 billion. If the captialistic model is going to endure, then something is going to have to give with the unions as well. Car manufacturers in the south like Mercedes, BMW and Kia have shown that workers can live quite well while not under a union contract. While I am a great believer that unionization has brought better working conditions to millions over the years as well as benefits that many would envy, our current financial mess is not going to go away over night and both sides must renegotiate compensation otherwise this industry is literally DOA regardless of the plan they offer congress next month.
ndtovent
· 1 year ago
Totally agree. But don't forget about universal health care. If we all had that, then these large companies wouldn't be burdened with providing it to their retirees for years on end. That would help matters (Don't get me wrong. The big 3 have built shitty cars for many years now, and have shown nothing but arrogant obstinance to much needed changes).
Andrew
· 1 year ago
You couldn't be more right and I imagine that is why Obama has made universal health care a major part of his campaign. Once the burden of health care can be removed from the equation for many companies, they could in fact run profitable enterprises.
RIPWAMU
· 1 year ago
Obama has not spoke of universal health care - that would mean government paid health care for all. Under his plan we keep our current plan but they negotiate lower premiums. Also, those without can buy into the government health plan.
RIPWAMU
· 1 year ago
Universal health care is the answer, especially a modernized version. However, it takes years to set that up and there are hard core lobbyists making sure it doesn't happen on the Hill. We have to pressure our reps and help Obama out.
RIPWAMU
· 1 year ago
I can see asking for a plan, but this is also a bridge loan that Ford may not even need to use. I don't think the request was very specific and in the 8 hours of testimony I heard them all say about 15 different times that they were going to use it for operating costs, paying their suppliers so they don't fail, GM will continue working on the Volt to get it out on time, to meet usual payroll etc. All of it depends on how much worse the economy gets and when (or if) credit defrosts. There are a lot of variables. Also, there are SEC guidelines and restrictions they need to abide by.
I was thinking this afternoon while watching some of the multiple hour goodbye to Ted Stevens (R- convicted felon) that he walks away with his pension intact (something like $160k/year for life) and paid health benefits for life. Then I think back to all the grumbling from the Senate and Reps about UAW retirees and that their pensions and health care should be eliminated. Sounds like the Fox news Fair and Balanced view.
Ferdiad
· 1 year ago
Here's an idea: in Chapter 11 bankruptcy, the Debtor has to propose a plan that is voted on by its creditors. Hmmm, sounds familiar, but the difference is that the plan is voted on by creditors, employees, shareholders, etc. as opposed to a bunch of goofs in Washington who have no idea what is is like to run a business. Disgusting.
sbjules
· 1 year ago
I think our representatives are nuts. The deal was for loans as I understand it. Literally millions of jobs are at stake. Union jobs. Give them the loans. These companies are not AIG!
All Comments
No panic, but careful consideration of an issue based upon the best available information. It is nice to have an adult in charge of the cheque book again.\
He will not be bullied or intimidated into incautious action.
Plus, no bonuses or golden parachutes, and all upper-management works for $1 a year for the next 10 years to fix this.
million+ dollars.
--
Adam D. Sperry, C.A.S.
N. Hollywood, CA, USA
818 982 8105
http://www.whokilledtheelectriccar.com/
Your actions are playing ping pong with the stock market! Blunders! 25 billion is nothing in comparison to the damage you are causing.
http://www.ibelievethis.us
Part of this bailout offer should include, as was noted in a WSJ editorial, that the very executives who flew private jets to Washington should be summarily fired along with their executive teams. Their jets sold as a good faith gesture, the money paid into the bailout total.
However, Washington rarely operates on the basis of what is right, but what is leveraged against the policy and who stands to gain the most.
More wads of chewing gum mashed into the dike....
*rimshot*
Alabama has been giving millions in tax benefits to these foreign automobile manufacturers.
We won't be able to make tanks or other artillery. Maybe not even aircraft. We will have it imported and can you imagine the security risks?
http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2008/11/20/white...
With all the GOP figuring out how to get welfare, can W get unemployment compensation?
Let's get rid of the greedy managers first and the other problems will resolve themselves.
Why shouldn't the auto makers be required to tell us exactly how they plan to spend the money?
And, if the goal is to really "save jobs," we should demand that two-thirds of the directors of the the auto companies be from the unions. And, no money until that happens.
"Wall Street" knows that including labor at the table means the days of cooking the books and fucking over the work force are coming to a close, and that profit reports will be harder and harder to lie about and fake. This will lead to the rise of investors with genuine acumen, as opposed to those with untrammeled greed. The meritocracy will be making the killings while the idiots suffer the losses, which would be an historic precedent, to say the least.
If that isn't happening, it spooks Wall Street and the banks.
1. The American consumer is tapped out having exhausted their credit lines from having used thier homes as ATM machines. So just where are the masses of people going to come from to buy Detroits cars?
2. Many can't even afford to stay in their homes. Foreclosures are the highest in history.
3. Detroit was behind the curve for the last twenty years. They kept building larger and faster cars thinking the party would never end when in fact quality control suffered which is why many began to purchase foreign imports.
4. Innovation seemed to be the last thing on Detroits mind while not realizing or at the least listening to the growing concerns from outside the US at first regarding the enviornment.
5. Yeah they'll be back with a plan, but reality dictates that innovation, technological upgrades and moving to alternative forms of energy for cars and trucks won't happen overnight. Waggoner from GM is pinning his hopes on the Chevy Volt, but is the first to admit that the car is two years off and will cost at least $40,000.
6. 25 Billion would be a drop in the ocean compared to what these companies will require to get through. Have we not learned anything from the AIG bailout that was to cost 85 Billion and now has eclipsed 170 billion?
It would make far more sense for the car manufacturers to reorganize through a chapter 11 while looking to develop strategic alliances with the Japanese and others to produce cars that can run on alternative fules. As I have said before here, the Japanese have already invented a car that can run on water. The Indians with Tata Motors have cars that can run on compressed air. It can be done, but it's going to take time and a hell of a lot more than 25 billion.
If the captialistic model is going to endure, then something is going to have to give with the unions as well. Car manufacturers in the south like Mercedes, BMW and Kia have shown that workers can live quite well while not under a union contract. While I am a great believer that unionization has brought better working conditions to millions over the years as well as benefits that many would envy, our current financial mess is not going to go away over night and both sides must renegotiate compensation otherwise this industry is literally DOA regardless of the plan they offer congress next month.
I was thinking this afternoon while watching some of the multiple hour goodbye to Ted Stevens (R- convicted felon) that he walks away with his pension intact (something like $160k/year for life) and paid health benefits for life. Then I think back to all the grumbling from the Senate and Reps about UAW retirees and that their pensions and health care should be eliminated. Sounds like the Fox news Fair and Balanced view.