DISQUS

AMERICAblog: How former South African president Mbeki sent 365,000 people to an early death

  • Bostonian_Queer_in_Dallas · 1 year ago
    American foreign policy has never given a shit about Africa...they are black and have no oil. The only time we ever even thought about Africa was when some dictator threatened to go Commie if we did not support his gold bath tubs and palaces. Maybe something will change with the big O. We can only hope.
  • MNPundit · 1 year ago
    I only care about Africa in as-much as if we don't care, some horrible disease will come out of there and kill us all. Oh wait that already happened.

    You're right, it's simple self-interest to make Africa at least marginally more functional.
  • elizabethcostello · 1 year ago
    While Mbeki's record on HIV/AIDS is and has been horrendous, it is really hyperbole verging on offensiveness to say he's been as bad as the apartheid-era governments. Do you have any idea--ANY IDEA--how horrific those governments were for the black, mixed-race, and South Asian and Arab South Africans? Black Africans in particular were denied every human right you or anyone else could think of when they weren't confined to homelands, barred from traveling overseas, imprisoned, slaughtered, and so on. I guess this nearly 100-year history has no bearing for you and can be wiped away, otherwise you wouldn't have said something that is so offensive. Criticize Mbeki harshly for his deplorable approach the HIV/AIDS crisis, but on many--MOST--other areas he was a breath of fresh air from the likes of de Klerk, Botha, Viljoen, Diederichs, Swart, etc.
  • An_American_Karol · 1 year ago
    elizabeth, how is being barred from traveling and imprisoned worse than a slow painful death by AIDs?
    Anyway you look at it, South Africa does not have a good track record in governing.
  • Milli · 1 year ago
    Right along with George Bush...
  • Steve_in_CNJ · 1 year ago
    when ideology is allowed to supersede reason, the consequences can be disastrous. fortunately that can't happen here in the civilized world. we have science and medicine.
  • Indigo · 1 year ago
    yeah, we do. an' we have lotsa really good people who care a lot about nice people too, you betcha! ;)
  • SCLiberal · 1 year ago
    "I've felt for years that someone should have gone in and forcibly removed this man from office by any means necessary."
    I'm pretty sure W felt that way about Saddam. Be careful of falling into the conservative "We are the police force of the world" mentality. We aren't and it doesn't work. Unless by "someone" you meant an internal uprising.
  • cmpnwtr · 1 year ago
    The lesson, don't elect leaders who are ignorant, and perpetuate their ignorance.
  • Older_Wiser · 1 year ago
    We have our own Mbekis in the US. Having said that, it's hard to criticize Africans who suffered so many years under colonialism and vote for these ignorant dictators. In SA, Somalia, Sudan, Zimbabwe and other countries around the Horn of Africa there have been many crop failures and the entire continent has been targeted as the most affected by global warming. Illiteracy is high and religionists of all stripes abound with their blend of superstitions and myths (including "abstinence education") which do absolutely nothing for Africans seeking a liberating life.

    One in four African infants do not reach their fifth birthday while millions of Africans have already starved to death recently. It is Katrina multiplied many, many times on that continent and with all the brain power out there, no answers yet because of politics and western exploitation.
  • Matthew G. Saroff · 1 year ago
    His behavior on Zimbabwe, which consists of sucking up to Mugabe, sucks too.
  • grandma · 1 year ago
    OT

    The State Canvassing Board, a panel of five arbiters charged with determining the winner in the overtime election tussle between Republican incumbent Norm Coleman and Democratic rival Al Franken, meet this morning in St. Paul to take up Franken's request to include rejected absentee ballots in the final tally.

    The board, headed by Democratic Secretary of State Mark Ritchie, is scheduled to gather at 9:30 a.m. CST

    http://www.startribune.com/politics/national/se...
  • cowboyneok · 1 year ago
    Remember, Sarah Palin, like most Republicans think Africa is just one big country over there. They don't give a rat's ass about Africa or their people. They have nothing Republicans want.
  • scooter in brooklyn · 1 year ago
    you betcha
  • cowboyneok · 1 year ago
    What do these candidates to succeed Tim Russert have in common?

    Answer: The choices all SUCK!

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/11/26/meet-t...
  • ProgressiveTroll · 1 year ago
    OT, I've read that FEMA will be removed from Homeland Security and James Lee Witt will return for 6 months to a year to fix it. I've been saying for some time Obama should just declare everything from the last 8 years void, at least as much as possible. I know some are pushing the crap that old Clinton people are bad, but that's bs. Not everything was perfect, but I seem to recall most things were pretty damn good!
  • Steve_in_CNJ · 1 year ago
    i can't get a straight answer on whether you are safe from HIV wearing magic underpants. but this answered many of my questions:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsXzHLiHTOU
  • Richie · 1 year ago
    Mbeki is not an idiot at all, and you are unaware of the real problems with so-called African AIDS John.

    In Africa, "AIDS" is largely diagnosed using the so-called Bangui definition, which says that you have AIDS if you have two major symptoms and one minor symptom. No "HIV test" is required! Major symptoms are weight loss, chronic diarrhea and chronic fever, minor symptoms include coughing and generalized itching. But these are precisely the symptoms of TB, malnutrition and parasitic infections, all widespread in Africa.

    Since international financial aid is tied to AIDS, the locals have learned to label any and every serious illness "AIDS".

    When HIV tests are performed, they are usually performed on pregnant women. I quote the The UNAIDS "AIDS epidemic update" of December 2002:

    "In countries with generalized epidemics, this image is based largely on HIV tests done on anonymous blood samples taken from women attending antenatal clinics."

    The problem with that is that pregnancy is a condition that causes false positives on HIV tests! Extrapolating those numbers to entire populations leads to grotesque overestimates of real HIV positivity.

    Another problem is that, as Emeritus Virginia Tech professor Henry H. Bauer has discovered, black people are intrinsically more likely to test false HIV positive, and this has nothing to do with sexual behavior.

    Critics have pointed these problems out for years, but only recently did the AIDS establishment admit that their apocalyptic projections of African AIDS were greatly overestimated.

    A November 20, 2007 story in the Washington Post titled U.N. to Cut Estimate Of AIDS Epidemic - Population With Virus Overstated by Millions concedes that the presumed epidemic "has been slowing for nearly a decade" and that "the far-reaching revisions amount to at least a partial acknowledgment of criticisms long leveled by outside researchers who disputed the U.N. portrayal of an ever-expanding global epidemic."

    Unfortunately, the AIDS establishment still can't admit that basic scientific problems exist with the very notion of African AIDS, and that the so-called African AIDS epidemic is very likely a relabeling of old, traditional and well-understood diseases related to poverty, unsanitary living conditions, septic drinking water and extreme malnutrition.

    Prof. Sam Mhlongo, MD, head of the Department of family medicine at The Medical University of Southern Africa, confirmed this interpretation at a conference on African AIDS held by the European Parliament in Brussels on December 8, 2003. He said:

    "In the middle 50's and 60's, 50% of black children were dead before the age of 5. The causes of death were recorded as: pneumonia, high fever, dehydration and intractable diarrhoea due to protein deficiency. Today, these clinical features are called AIDS. Today in South Africa, TB is the leading cause of death and morbidity amongst Africans, but this is called AIDS. "

    So yes, people ARE dying in Africa. No one denies that. The question is, what are they dying from? The evidence says they're dying from effects of poverty, and you can't treat poverty with chemotherapy drugs. On the contrary, if you treat already malnourished, sick people with toxic AIDS drugs, they'll only die faster.

    Mbeki deserves a medal.
  • Steve_in_CNJ · 1 year ago
    how about the Nobel prize in Medicine for coming up with garlic and lemon juice to treat TB and malnutrition? your comment is a joke. unfortunately, there are 350,000 dead south africans and their families who aren't laughing.
  • Brad · 1 year ago
    Thank you for your work. It's easier to to get angry and lash out than put facts into context.
  • Arthur Chalinsky · 1 year ago
    "forcibly removed this man from office by any means necessary"

    Good to know you are a supporter of the so called 'Bush doctrine'. Last time I read this blog I think.

    As much as I oppose Mbeki, for reasons including the one your are discussing, you don't have the right to change other people's governments by force, subversion, or any other means. Neither does the government of the USA, or the UK, or France, or China, or Russia, or anyone. You are accusing Mbeki of genocide while advocating war crimes. In fact, the supreme international war crime, according to the Geneva conventions. Although I suppose as a supporter of neo-conservative foreign policy, you also believe the Geneva conventions are "quaint". It is impossible to conclude otherwise from your statement.

    Perhaps a return to western controlled dictators for South Africa sounds like a good idea to you, but it would be just as criminal as the invasion of Iraq, the coup in Haiti, or any of the numerous war crimes we have been complacent in, in this decade or any other.

    Incidentally, George Bush and America's anti-condom policy that we are all directly responsible for has and will continue to result in a much larger genocide in Africa than Mbeki could ever achieve.
  • Arthur Chalinsky · 1 year ago
    "He ought to be with the 365,000 people he killed."

    Then what does that say about us? We are directly responsible for the deaths of over one million innocent civilians under the Bush administration alone. Should George Bush be executed? Should everyone who contributed tax dollars which paid for the cluster bombs and depleted uranium that have devastated a handful of countries this decade be executed? Not to mention his genocidal 'abstinence only' tyranny, which will end up killing millions.

    I expect to read ignorance like this from Bill Kristol. I really didn't expect it from John Aravosis. Good to know that when the Obama administration starts propagandizing for its first aggressive war, so called liberal commentators will rush to defend his crimes even faster than most of you did in the aftermath of September 11th, cheerleader for the war crimes we have committed in Afghanistan.
  • stoic · 1 year ago
    "I've felt for years that someone should have gone in and forcibly removed this man from office by any means necessary."

    You think you'd have learned your lesson from Saddam.
  • ivyfree · 1 year ago
    Good grief. Yeah, people should make a habit of invading other countries and deposing leaders they don't like. We'd have gotten rid of George Bush that much sooner. John, you're smarter than this.
  • MNPundit · 1 year ago
    The world removed Mbeki? Ridiculous. It sucks that lots of people die but lots of people die everyday in horrible ways.
  • skeptic · 1 year ago
    John

    Quit insulting pigs. They are wonderful animals and nothing like this creep Mbeki!
  • KenStarr · 1 year ago
    He did more than that. Read what he did to every black South African in Naomi Klein's "Shock Doctrine". The economic suffering of South Africa for the benefit of the former ruling class is well exposed, and you can lay it on Mbeki's head. I hate Milton Friedman. And the IMF, who is now screwing Iceland.
  • Brad · 1 year ago
    http://searchwarp.com/swa333942.htm

    "A recently concluded double-blind placebo controlled trial of the herbal supplement Sutherlandia OPC has confirmed what thousands of users already knew - Sutherlandia OPC is 100% effective in reversing HIV symptoms.

    In the article " Success Against Cancer and HIV in South Africa " I reported how the Sutherlandia OPC supplement from South Africa designed by South African HIV and cancer crusader and researcher Marc Swanepoel had been virtually 100% successful in stabilizing and reversing HIV symptoms and over 90% successful against a broad range of cancers."
  • serge · 1 year ago
    Harsh words, John, but I couldn't agree more. There are cynical deniers, and then there are idiots. Mbeki is an idiot. South Africa blossomed into the most beautiful flower upon Mandela's election, and they handled over a century of horrid abuse of the majority in a most civilised way. Then, they get Mbeki? That was a crime in itself.
  • Navid · 1 year ago
    AIDS denial in Africa isn't limited to, much less caused by, Mbeki. It's kind of silly and reductive to pretend otherwise. Read this report on AIDS in Nigeria, published some years ago in the Village Voice.

    http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-11-09/news/par...
  • Reasons To Be Cheerful, Part 3 · 1 year ago
    Just goes to show that leadership DOES matter after all. South Africa went from Nelson Mandela, an inspiration to the whole world, to this nitwit.
  • Brad · 1 year ago
    Drug companies want to "protect" us by blocking our access to natural remedies, our free speech about health, and establish paltry trade-sanction backed international "safe upper-limits" to supplements we can buy over the counter.

    They intend to accomplish this through CODEX Alimentarius, established under WHO in 1962, to club defiant nations into submission. They depend on the rogue FDA to send traitorous representatives to undermine, not reflect, the will of the people expressed under US grass roots 1994 DSHEA law. Law that binds FDA regulatory power.

    Safe upper limits are for toxins, so building blocks of healthy tissue systems are transformed into poison by words declaring that they are, with no evidence. No dead bodies.

    Meanwhile, prescription drugs, properly taken as prescribed, are among the top 3 causes of death in the USA, if not the number one cause.

    Sick `em, John.