Remember, John, he's (Obama) still a straight guy.
dad
· 1 year ago
bastard.
Dianne_in_DC
· 1 year ago
I think we all should be furious and let Obama know. I'm still po-ed with Joe Biden's wife buying a German Shepherd Dog from a puppy mill. We took in 10 GSD at the Washington Animal Rescue League last week, from a hoarding situation, all under 2 years old. Keep making noise!
Indigo
· 1 year ago
I'm with you on the dog thing. What's the Biden family all about? One needs a dog to make a good impression so one goes to the American Kennel Club to secure the perfect dog. How very aristocratic, oh, my! The Bidens, eh? We'll remember that name.
Ron S
· 1 year ago
As an animal rights advocate, let me tell you from experience:
Even though the Democrats are more likely to help you reach your goals than the Republicans, it is by no means certain.
You have to constantly fight for your cause, no matter which party is in the White House or Congress.
Michael
· 1 year ago
"if we don't beat the crap out of our elected officials on a regular basis."
You mean actually do our part in our democracy?
Ben Dover
· 1 year ago
K.O. just reporting that Warren has issued a statement commending Barry for standing up to us. Warren just basically patted Barry on the head. Now Barry is going to want a tummy rub too most likely. What a sell out Barry turns out to be.
Bush Bites
· 1 year ago
LOL.
Four "Barrys" in one posting.
warbler
· 1 year ago
Olberman suggesting that maybe Obama did this JUST so he could make a pro gay statement. Turning the expected backlash in his favor. Sounds smart. Obama, by selecting Warren, is free to dispute him as publicly and harshly as he wants. He set Warren up.
Marck
· 1 year ago
Puh-leeze. When DJ Obama said that he was against same sex marriage "because God is in the mix" he didn't me that either. You Obama cultists crack me up. He hates da gays. Period.
warbler
· 1 year ago
Please believe that if you want. You're wrong, though.
RainbowPhoenix
· 1 year ago
He doesn't hate us. If he did, he would have fought the ENDA, the repeal of DADT, and the hate crimes expansion.
Bart
· 1 year ago
Obama doesn't hate gays, neither is he a flaming homophobe like Warren. But is is a crass politician ala Bill Clinton who doesn't appear to be able to pass up a good bus to toss gays under for his greater political benefit, nor is he at all reticent to promise the moon during his campaign, then flip completely after he's safely elected.
PeteWa
· 1 year ago
lol John, I admire your optimism... something I can't claim for myself.
Barack Obama supported gay rights during his Illinois Senate tenure. He sponsored legislation in Illinois that would ban discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.
Barack Obama in the United States Senate:
Every two years the Human Rights Campaign, the largest national gay and lesbian organization, issues a scorecard for members of the Senate based on their sponsorship and voting on key issues of importance to gay and lesbian citizens. Barack Obama scored 89 out of 100% in the 2006 scorecard. Here’s how HRC rated Barack Obama:
Barack Obama on Hate Crimes:
Barack Obama co-sponsored legislation to expand federal hate crimes laws to include crimes perpetrated because of sexual orientation and gender identity.
Employment Non-Discrimination:
Barack Obama supports the Employment Non-Discrimination Act and believes it should be expanded to include sexual orientation and gender identity.
Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell – Gays in the Military:
Barack Obama believes we need to repeal the “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” policy and allow gays and lesbians to serve openly in the military. His campaign literature says, “The key test for military service should be patriotism, a sense of duty, and a willingness to serve.”
Gay & Lesbian Adoption:
Barack Obama believes gays and lesbians should have the same rights to adopt children as heterosexuals.
Barack Obama and Gay Marriage/ Civil Unions:
Although Barack Obama has said that he supports civil unions, he is against gay marriage. In an interview with the Chicago Daily Tribune, Obama said, “I’m a Christian. And so, although I try not to have my religious beliefs dominate or determine my political views on this issue, I do believe that tradition, and my religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman.”
Barack Obama did vote against a Federal Marriage Amendment and opposed the Defense of Marriage Act in 1996.
He said he would support civil unions between gay and lesbian couples, as well as letting individual states determine if marriage between gay and lesbian couples should be legalized.
“Giving them a set of basic rights would allow them to experience their relationship and live their lives in a way that doesn’t cause discrimination,” Obama said. “I think it is the right balance to strike in this society.”
Bart
· 1 year ago
Mind-Changer-Elect Obama is in a new arena where he now has to keep the right-wing media at bay and as many of the conservatives with him as possible to have any chance to accomplish his important agenda items. Trust ONLY what you see him DO -- NOTHING of what he says that might otherwise make you feel more secure about him. He's a master wordsmith. Words for him are cheap as air. Expect action and trust only action.
warbler
· 1 year ago
The Time piece you link to is an opinion piece, worth no more than your opinion. It was written by John Cloud who wrote the Time cover article PRAISING Ann Coulter. Take it from where it comes.
h/t from John Cole's Balloon Juice. Says everything that needs to be said IMHO.
tlsintx
· 1 year ago
Seriously, with Obama's logic, Fred Phelps should be up there giving a prayer too. Keep calling bullshit.
There comes a time when you have to do what's right and standing up to these bigots hiding behind religion is what is right.
Mother Bottom
· 1 year ago
SHAME ON YOU MS. OBAMA, SHAME!!!!!
Girls, love to all. I too have had enough slaps in the face from BHO and he hasn't even taken office yet. Rick Warren is a fat bloated turd -- who hates me and friends for being who we are. and there is ms. obama kissing her fat booty -- shame!!!!
this is not change -- this is hate!!!! gay is the new black, girls. it is going to be a bumpy 4 years!!!
happy holidays, girls. we have been kicked before; and yes, we always get up and shine!!!
warbler
· 1 year ago
This cannot be a serious comment. It sounds like it was written by a punked out straight kid who's trying to mimic gay-speak. Gay people still don't talk this way, do they?
Indigo
· 1 year ago
Mother Bottom does.
Bush Bites
· 1 year ago
No, it's legit.
He/she is a regular.
renegademom
· 1 year ago
From all I have read, Obama welcomes dissent. He pays attention to it. He doesn't find it threatening, but informative. He learns from it. Dissent and pressure on our government are our duty. HOW we do it is another story.
I've been out as a dyke since 1978. I've marched on DC 3 times: 1979 (euphoria), 1988 (height of the plague), and 1983 (right around when cocktails started saving lives). I've been disowned by my family several times, watched Reagan ignore AIDS and worse while so many beloved friends and family died, navigated a nightmare "divorce" without the benefit of the legal structure that benefits hets, adopted three black kids before it was trendy, and went through my 30s and 40s without the domestic partner benefits that so many now enjoy.
And frankly, I couldn't care less that Warren is speaking. I applaud the lgbt/queer community for taking responsibility for itself, for keeping the pressure on, for not relying on anyone else.
And....
Can we please do it without the victim crap? It is what it is. Get to work. And don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.
Michael
· 1 year ago
OMG Amen. I've been thinking the same thing... this has registered exactly a 0 on my upset-scale. Why people are surprised that he's acting like the President of the UNITED STATES is beyond me. Who said Obama planned on being king of the Gays?
Give me a break and how about getting angry at the impotent national LGBT organizations in stopping things like Prop 8 (going on vacation while the Mormons eat our lunch, WTF?!?).
Marcus
· 1 year ago
Right. Clearly, gay people are upset because Obama isn't replacing the Stars and Stripes with the Rainbow.
Apparently, gays aren't part of the United States, or at least, not quite as much as other people.
Marck
· 1 year ago
" I actually trusted the guy. I know, stupid me."
A lot of the LGBT community got "sweet talked" by Mr. Smooth. Like many men on the downlow, they get what they want from the gays, then bash our heads in. In Downlowbama's case, he just threw us under the bus, while proclaiming his love.
Ugh. He sickens me.
Clonus
· 1 year ago
Rev. Joseph Lowrey, a brilliant progressive and civil rights champion, is giving the benediction, which is longer than the invocation, and everyone will remember the benediction because it comes at the end of the ceremony. The fact that Warren's giving the invocation is trivial and will be soon forgotten. By accepting the invitation to do the invocation, Warren is bending a little, too. What;s remains to be seen is what Warren says to his congregation after the inauguration's over.
Seems to me that a lot of people on the left were furious that Obama didn't attack the McCain campaign, and it turned out Obama knew exactly what he was doing. I think he knows exactly what he's doing here, and it has nothing to do with Obama lying or going back on his word. It's tactics versus strategy again, and Obama is a brilliant strategist.
Indigo
· 1 year ago
Brilliant? Yes, he lame-ducked himself in one move. That's not easy.
lucky hussein
· 1 year ago
didn't attack the McCain campaign, and it turned out Obama knew exactly what he was doing
well, he did win. but, it's not neccesarity the best move, imo theoritically, you would need to go back in time and see what happens after trying the attack. I think he still would have won, and we would be better off if he had attacked. It would have educated people for 1 thing..
Lolis
· 1 year ago
All of us trusting Obama less is not a bad thing. We should be very thankful that although he has invited Rick Warren to pray with him he has not invited evangelicals into his cabinet or his science department. He made a few more great picks today on these issues, besides Solis. I assume this probably be the first time an all-out gay rights/human rights pastor like Lowery will be giving a prayer also.
I hope the LGBT community is encouraged by how many allies you have within the grassroots Democratic Party. We can change it from the bottom up.
Bart
· 1 year ago
One of his great picks: "Obama selects retired Admiral Dennis Blair (supporter of Indonesian junta's brutality against East Timor) as Director of National Intelligence."
Indigo
· 1 year ago
Marcos is too kind. Words that contradict deeds are called lies. Mr. Obama is lying. If Mr. Obama wants a more affirmative take on his deeds, he has to dump Rick Warren.
Mark
· 1 year ago
People who scream at each other don't have a chance of changing the others opinions. By having a cordial relationship with Warren, Obama will be in a position to maybe change Warren's views. And the people who follow Warren may be more willing to listen to Obama. Remember, Bush didn't care about listening to the opposition. It was a major flaw. Does anyone want Obama to make the same mistake?
Michael
· 1 year ago
Or maybe Obama will never change Warren's mind on Gays but will partner with him on some of those other Christian issues: poverty (which looks certain for us all nowdays) and AIDS.
It's breathtaking how quickly we've become jilted lovers even before he's actually the President! Ugh.
Joel
· 1 year ago
FYI. I was never an Obama supporter. I could never get past his disclaimers about gay rights. If someone doesn't personally believe I deserve equality, then they will never stand up for my equality.
Indigo
· 1 year ago
He already did and he isn't inaugurated yet.
Ohio_Dem
· 1 year ago
and people who won't stand up for themselves will never achieve equality. If African Americans were treated the way the glbt community is treated, freaking cities would burn! They would NOT stand for it, so why would you? YOU ARE EQUAL. Demand your rightful place at the table. btw - I am a straight retired woman and I passionately believe that all people are created equal and that all law abiding, tax paying citizens of the united states deserve EQUALITY. I have no respect for Obama's decision and I don't buy his excuse for why he invited a professional homophobe. If he truely wants to reach out to everyone, then let him bring on the racists and prove it. I dont buy it for a second. This is not change. This is business as usual.
Bart
· 1 year ago
Obama is skilled at sending coded messages to our detractors along with those he wants us to believe.
Kristine
· 1 year ago
I for one am not shocked at this. I was a Hillary supporter and when Obama won the primary, I did throw my support behind him but very skeptically. Now with his recent backing off on the windfall tax for oil companies and now this issue of inviting Warren my fears and concerns about Obama seem to be supported by his actions. The way he is making moderate choices and trying to have all voices heard make him seem wishy washy and a hypocrite. Sure he states he is for equal rights for the LGBT community but his actions are not showing that. Him stating that well, sure he invited Warren but he also invited a pro-gay minister does not sit well with me and feels like a slap in the face of the constituents that gave him the win in the election. Perhaps he should invite David Duke to speak at the inauguration too since he wants everyone to come to the table!
Indigo
· 1 year ago
I hear you very clearly. I was with Hillary until Caroline Kennedy spoke up for Mr. Obama. I was even for Caroline to be the junior senator from New York until recently. Now, not.
How can Caroline support a gay-basher in the White House and expect to be the junior senator from New York? She can't.
As for David Duke, why not invite him to give his views on Dr. King's contribution to post-Confederate Southern culture on MLK Day? It's come to that. And who brought it on? Mr. Obama brought it on.
Marcus
· 1 year ago
I think Bob Jones III might be a better choice. The man is a legitimate minister. I'm sure he's done something to help the poor in his life. Obama should reach out to the Jones family and the University, and show how big he is by working together with people who believe his conception was a perverted abomination.
Bart
· 1 year ago
Noted. Some Obama staffer just took a note.
kladinvt
· 1 year ago
What this feels like is being in a relationship with someone who promised fidelity, but the first chance they got, went tramping around with the scuzzy guy with the brown paper bag who hangs out on the street corner! Not a good feeling, nor a good start (pre-start) to Obama's presidency.
Bart
· 1 year ago
Certainly makes me want to do something besides watch the boob tube on inauguration day.
Joel
· 1 year ago
I'm not surprised at all. With every invocation of support for gay rights by Obama, he added his disclaimer. "I personally don't agree with it." The first people to get a reality check on Obama's promises were the gays serving our country. He won't address that issue until 2010, he needs to build consensus. Blah blah blah blah...
I wish people would stop making up excuses for Obama, he has to say those things, he has to build consensus, he really believes we deserve equal rights. Bull. What we needed is a leader who is willing to be the example and do the right thing and what we got is a brilliant strategist. It's worked out well for him, but we are once again left behind.
XRASTONE
· 1 year ago
This has radicalized my 8 year old daughter Edith -- whose uncle is gay and in a relationship that predates her birth. She says: "No 8 No Proposition 8" and made a poster. She wants to know what kids can do to have no Proposition 8s.
jane
· 1 year ago
Religion destroys everything and adults who have an imaginary friend, and openly admits it, should be institutionalized.
dad
· 1 year ago
it seems to be the case.
RainbowPhoenix
· 1 year ago
What seems to be the case?
Atlanta Jim
· 1 year ago
John, keep the discussion alive.
As a community we have caved too many times. But on a good note....I attended a rural Georgia County Democratic meeting tonight. When the name Rick Warren came up, it was a unified groan...that is true change...and no one tried to defend Obama.
warbler
· 1 year ago
John, I hope you're enjoying the vitriol in these comments.
This is getting to be rabble-rousing.
tlsintx
· 1 year ago
this is how it's supposed to work. the elected officials are supposed to listen to the people they represent. not just the straight ones, either.
jimkhm
· 1 year ago
It isn't just on the gay issue, it is the Iraq war, SOSS (Save Our Social Security), the budget deficit, and on and on it goes. I don't know that we always need to "beat the crap" out of our officials. Sometimes just a phone call that one is concerned about an issue, and one supports their Representative, or Senator is enough. It gives them the amo to say my constituents are calling about this issue, and it lets them know that they are supported. I have two elected officials whose homes were vandalized for taking a position. Sometimes the elected officials just need to know he or she is supported, and it is worth the aggravation. Besides sometimes the officials agree with us.
Bart
· 1 year ago
After years of trying, I have yet to see a shred of evidence any of the phone calls, emails, letters or petitions I have signed have made single ripple in the political waters.
Ohio_Dem
· 1 year ago
John you need to be on cable news, talk shows, etc We need someone strong who will say exactly what you have been saying. Not one person will dare use the argument, why isnt obama reaching out to racists. that needs to be asked in living rooms all over the united states. if he truely believes that EVERYONE has to be heard, let him prove it. otherwise, it shows everyone that he is NOT being inclusive at all. People just do not get it. You can't support civil rights for one minority and then turn around and bash another if your goal is to be inclusive. This is divisive as hell.
Webster
· 1 year ago
Thank all the Ancient Golden Goddesses for Rachel Maddow.
Panasit Ch
· 1 year ago
I questioned Obama's stance on gay rights since the beginning. That's why I was for Hillary because with her, at least she's firm on abortion and civil rights, but of course, there were other problems. I understand the whole thing with Warren from his perspective, but I also understand why he doesn't understand it from OUR perspective. He thinks that gays and anti-gays are just people who disagree. He didn't realize that the gay people just exist and the anti gay just wants to make their entire existence a sin or something that is not real. Obama doesn't think this way. He wouldn't link an anti-gay person with a racist person in his head. And that is sad. But hey, he's trying. As sad as this may sound, the reason I may not be disappointed by him is because I didn't expect this much from him in regards to this issue for begin with.
Bart
· 1 year ago
I was put off at first too. I never for a minute believed it had to do with anything other than political expedience and that he had decided he wanted to court the evangelical vote. What he's doing now is completely consistent. And what I expect him to do in the future is also to maintain that consistency unless an overwhelming force is applied to make him see the reasonableness of our positions.
Jackson Thersites
· 1 year ago
Yes, he is triangulating.
eclare
· 1 year ago
He's a smart guy. He KNOWS our position is reasonable. He just doesn't really care.
Gary SF
· 1 year ago
Sadly, this is the way it is. For all the good that FDR did, he only acted in response to people demonstrating against the many injustices. The is the model and we need to be aware of it.
Oh, and Hillary Clinton was WORSE than Obama on GLBT issues. Hillary wanted the issue of marriage to be left up to each state and also, she only wanted some parts of DOMA repealed. Obama said he wanted all of DOMA repealed. Not a lot worse than Obama, but definitely worse.
tlsintx
· 1 year ago
Jane Hamsher does a good job educating stupid clueless CNN dork...
you know, I really didn't like him supporting the Peruvian Free Trade agreement. he said it needed work and voted on it anyway. that looked pretty half-assed to me.
next FISA. instead of eating his wheaties and getting to work in the senate - he said he'd keep his eyes on it when he became President. well, what if he hadn't made it? so, he responded as a candidate rather than as a Senator? THAT looked pretty half-assed to me.
here we go again.
a lot of media people crush on Warren because he believes in GRAVITy and such. big whoop. I think more people are going to crush on Warren and this will be at least part of the reason.
I don't like it and I'm more than a little taken aback that many accuse ME of being the intolerant guy. Am I Garp beating the bad driver to be civilized? I don't think so. I think all the people who proudly raised their heads that they wouldn't sit at the table with gays have become more accepted OVERNIGHT. their bias and bigotry is being presented as a political position!
Everybody who is spanking our hands for not being cool with Warren must certainly agree - gay haters, anti-immigrant race baiters - they are just expressing valid political positions? bullshit. this smooths off Warren's jagged edges and makes him go down America's collective throat that much smoother.
yeah, it's great hearing Obama say he's going to stand up for gays but I think he's going at it half-assed.
lpeggy
· 1 year ago
Some of the racial comments made on here in the last 24 hours, remind me of the FALSE allegations that Prop 8 passed because of Black voters. Why is it when something goes wrong, the comments always end up being about race? Somethings never change.
Ohio_Dem
· 1 year ago
You are missing the point. it's not "race" its about MINORITIES. You can't claim to be "reaching out" and "disagree without being disagreeable" ONLY when it comes to the gay minority. Jews are a minority. Blacks are a minority. I passionately stand up for their civil rights just as I stand up for lgbt civil rights.
Obama is not doing this. He has invited a gay bashing homophobe, so the question is, why isn't he inviting a Jew hating neo-nazi or a white supremicist. hatred of a minority is hatred of a minority whether they be gay, black, jewish, or whatever. it's not about race. it's about being fair and believing in the equality of ALL minorities.
MichaelS
· 1 year ago
John,
Taking your comments one step further... On Inauguration Day there is a GLBT (unofficial) ball. The organizers of this event should make the biggest stink possible about the Warren choice, and turn the ball into a "protest event", and invite lots of press. And then the talent that's hired should continually and unremittingly attack Obama's betrayal of the community and his implicit endorsement of the removal of our rights. How can we make this happen? Who has the contacts? The other route to take is to flood the Obama web site with comments condemning this choice. Together, these actions could keep his feet held to the fire.
Carol
· 1 year ago
I really don't understand everyone's outrage at the selection of Warren. Where is your pride in Dr. Lowery who is large outspoken supporter of LGT, it seems people are crying foul for no reason. Before you ask no I am not gay, but I support my gay nephew along with his partner against his mother to the point where I am currently on probation for whooping her butt for calling them "fags, queers etc" in my presence after being warned once about messing with them.
If we constantly yell about EVERYTHING we lose credibility when we have serious policy or governing issues with Obama.
Kristine
· 1 year ago
it seems the point of this is that Obama claims to be for equal rights for the LGBT community and then invites this bigoted individual who was instrumental in the Prop 8 issue in CA. He can't proclaim he is for equal rights and then turn around and give a man like this the legitimacy he is by having him have an active role in the inauguration. That is a blatent hypocrisy. If you had to deal with the unequality that the GLBT community deals with on a daily basis and on top of that you wouldn't be able to have the same 1000+ rights that straight couples enjoy, perhaps you would view this quite differently. Nobody can really t understand the second class status that the GLBT community deals with unless they have actually experienced it themselves.
Bart
· 1 year ago
I wish we really did yell about everything. Maybe heterosexuals would get so tired of the yelling they would just go back to their usual bashing and exploiting of each other and get the hell out of our civil rights.
JayR
· 1 year ago
It wouldn't make it any less offensive to follow an antisemite with a rabbi...
political_correctness
· 1 year ago
I think it's a bit early to throw in the glbt towel. Give the man a chance to do his best as president then pass judgment. Your kind of putting the chicken ahead of the egg in this situation.
Craig
· 1 year ago
Do you people think spamming every blog with these obvious talking points is going to fool anyone. Prop 8 changed everything. You ever reached. There is nothing you can say that's going to change what's coming- a bona fide grade A movement. I got friends who were apolitical. Now , with your actions theya re not. No you go on as many sites as you need to use your talking points.
Craig
· 1 year ago
sorry I hit reply for the wrong poster.
Craig
· 1 year ago
I am a l ittle pissed at you. You should never, ever, trust a politician. Obama is a good one, but he is still a politician. Never confuse the reality with what he says. We need to push until we get what we want. It's that simple.
Anthony Look
· 1 year ago
If this was the Nazi era and I was of Jewish descent and a president elect chose a vocal anti Jewish Nazi sympathizer to participate in his inaguration; how should I feel. Obama's lack of sensitivity and outright pandering with overtures to conservative extremists only says to the gay community that Obama tolerates their claims of equating gay men and women with pedofiles and gay marriage rights as a slippery slope to beastiality. Quiet desperation, stunned into a rage of betrayal is how the gay community finds itself. First Obama's betrayal on FISA, then his Pelosi/Reid like capitulation to Lieberman coupled with his continuation of obvious right of center choices for his cabinet and the choice of this bigot homophobe to participate in his inaguration; only demonstrates what many in the gay community feared all along, Obama is showing his true Christian Black Homophobe roots. This president is not a friend of the gay community. His selection of Rick Warren is tantamount to condoning racism.
Bart
· 1 year ago
I think Jane Hamsher's CNN comments were right on. Obama knew how gays would feel and react to this and he just plain didn't give a shit. He felt he could gain more points with the haters by punching us in the eye than he could lose from us captive gays.
a. mcewen
· 1 year ago
This situation just reminds us that no one is going to give us what we want unless we hold their feet to the fire.
The religious right does it even with politicians who suppor them. We need to do it with those who support us.
BHBuck
· 1 year ago
When he says he's going to challenge homophobia, even in his own community, I believe him. Now I believe a little bit less.
John, Amen! Is the same point I was trying to make over at Balloon-Juice. We who are upset and complaining are considered "wankers" there.
JayR
· 1 year ago
Yeah I trusted him too. Perhaps because he lives in my neighborhood and the place is liberal as hell as is his background. Even if he's full of it I still don't understand why he would use his inauguration to pick a culture war fight. This was entirely unnecessary. He could have pandered to the fundies some other time. They weren't asking for anything just yet.
devlzadvocate
· 1 year ago
"Now I'm waiting to see when rhetoric becomes reality." I've waited for countless politicians, presidents and legislators and bills to be passed. Some of us are getting a tad older and are tired of waiting for the crumbs being thrown to us for the great price being paid.
No waiting. Only fighting back.
larry
· 1 year ago
When Warren stands to lead the invocation. Stand up, turn your back, stand quietly, head unbowed, proud, defiant.
devlzadvocate
· 1 year ago
nah uh. Shoes.
Diogenes
· 1 year ago
nah uh. Boos. They travel further.
devlzadvocate
· 1 year ago
You've never seen me hurl my Manolos when I get my pantyhose bunched up.
Indigo
· 1 year ago
Obama & Madoff, Ponzi Schemes R Us.
Chris From Maine
· 1 year ago
Obama talked a good game about change. Now he has abandoned change for "more of the same".
Keeping Gates, going soft on pulling out of Iraq, voting for FISA, Hillary as Sec'y of State, now this.
If you want change you should check your pockets. It aint gonna come from Washington.
archiesdad
· 1 year ago
I fully understand how you feel. I too have such faith and optimism at the start, and then see the half measures and the sops thrown and the gifts and favoritism and my heart sinks. I had such high hopes with Clinton, too. I am a cockeyed optimist.
Dogman
· 1 year ago
I believed in Kucinich...wish more had, too.
Diogenes
· 1 year ago
Next time. I'm done with lying Dems.
RitornaVincitor
· 1 year ago
Don't be hard on yourself, John. I like you. I knew that the minute I saw you in that video with that dog, and the way you talked to him. OK, I liked you before that too.
BHBuck
· 1 year ago
It's the feeling of being kicked in the teeth. We in the gay community worked hard and tirelessly too to help get Barack elected. Look at all the hard work John A. put into it! I know I've put in many an hour of pro-Obama blogging myself.
AND HE WON! What a wonderful day that was. What a wonderful feeling. A distinct promise of CHANGE was coming our way. Finally.
But lately, bad economic news has been putting a damper on inauguration day, (for me anyways). I was hoping for a sunny day and a record-breaking attendance. A joyful time, in deed!
Now, I feel like I've just been uninvited. I feel like a fool.
And I've got all these people standing around me, telling me to shut the hell up and stop complaining.
Great country, huh?
Yankton
· 1 year ago
I am a member of PFLAG. My son is gay. I can't tell you how appalled I am to read comments like this:
Obama is a homophobic douche who loves gay money but hates gay people.
What on earth makes you say such a hateful and untrue thing?
Maybe it's my age, but the awful comments here make me wonder why I've spent so much time over the past 15 years sticking my neck out by speaking up for tolerance and acceptanceof gays in a VERY intolerant part of the country.
It seems to me that some people here have become exactly what they claim they hate.
For most of you, I'm old enough to be your grandfather. Your hatred has made me feel very, very sad. Right now, I'm ready to throw in the towel. Why bother?
Steve_in_CNJ
· 1 year ago
i regret anyone calling him a douche, but all evidence is that obama is a libertarian supremacist on this issue. in other words, he feels gays and lesbians are inferior (perhaps defective, like the physically disabled) but would not put the government in charge of curtailing our rights. if i'm right, his segregationist views on marriage would change if he thought it wouldn't cost him anything.
devlzadvocate
· 1 year ago
What if Warren comes out of this looking, maybe not bad, but less than good?
Steve_in_CNJ
· 1 year ago
that's the only "save" for obama. but he has to forswear rhetoric like "bringing the sides together". that validates warren.
devlzadvocate
· 1 year ago
I wasn kinda thinking "what if all the other speakers totally overshadow him". Along the lines of another comment that the closing benediction will be made by Civil Rights leader Lowry.
BHBuck
· 1 year ago
Yankton, I can appreciate how you feel. But, trust me, gays have had to put up with a hell of a lot more hate than you have.
You think you've had it bad. Walk a mile in our "pumps".
Gary SF
· 1 year ago
Uh, this comes on the heels of proposition 8, which felt like a gay bashing to many of us. So you think that Obama's selection of Warren - who compares same-sex marriage to incest and child molestation was right?
Gary SF
· 1 year ago
How Obama can make this up to us - by changing this:
US balks at backing condemnation of anti-gay laws
Alone among major Western nations, the United States has refused to sign a declaration presented Thursday at the United Nations calling for worldwide decriminalization of homosexuality.
The US is choosing to stand firm in solidarity with gay-executing Muslim nations. Remember when some on the right side of the aisle argued that one of the reasons for being in Iraq was to bring a stop to this practice?
Hypocrites.
MNPundit
· 1 year ago
Didn't Obama ask this very thing of us towards the end of the campaign?
Garrett in SF
· 1 year ago
This is very much like the battle over sitting down with world leaders without any preconditions. As many Republicans feared, it seem he really may be too naive. Warren's just had his career solidified as the next "Billy Graham" -- what did he give up to get that blessing from Obama? Nothing. He missed an opportunity to push for much deeper movement towards inclusiveness. You can have a conversation with those you disagree with without letting them benefit to this extent.
Obama’s Divisive Choice of Rick Warren By Michelle Goldberg December 18, 2008
Warren is something of a magician. He has convinced much of the media and many influential Democrats that he represents a new, more centrist breed of evangelical with a broader agenda than the old religious right. This is, in many ways, deceptive. Yes, Warren has done a lot of work on AIDS in Africa, but he supports the same types of destructive, abstinence-only policies as the Bush administration. One of his protegés, Ugandan pastor Martin Ssempa, has been a major force in moving that country away from its lifesaving safer-sex programs. He’s been known to burn condoms at Makerere University, the prestigious school in Uganda’s capital, and in his Pentecostal services, marked by much sobbing and speaking in tongues, he offers the promise of faith healing to his desperate congregants, a particularly cruel ruse in a country ravaged by HIV.
The truth is that the primary difference between Warren and, say, James Dobson is the former’s penchant for Hawaiian shirts. [...] Speaking to the Wall Street Journal earlier this year, Warren himself described his differences with Dobson as “mainly a matter of tone,” and was unable to come up with a theological issue on which they disagree.
If Democrats collaborate in positioning Warren as the centrist alternative to the religious right, they consign vast numbers of people, including many of the party’s most dedicated supporters, to the fringe. “It does strengthen Warren as kind of a new Billy Graham figure,” says the Reverend Dan Schultz, a United Church of Christ pastor and the founder of the progressive religious blog Street Prophets. That has especial relevance for Warren’s role in Africa, where a very conservative kind of evangelical Christianity is exploding, bringing with it virulently anti-gay politics. “What I have heard is that it will help Warren overseas,” Schultz says of Warren’s role in the inauguration. “He’s big into work in Africa. This will give him a lot of clout over there. Part of the reason this is kind of insulting for me is that Warren has supported some pretty awful people in Africa, including people who think homosexuals should be jailed.”
[...]
“This is not a gay issue, this is not about abortion, it’s about every aspect of sexual equality and dignity,” says the feminist writer and philosopher Linda Hirshman. “This is about every woman who supported the president-elect, not just the gay ones and not just the ones needing abortions.” After all, Warren is not just anti-abortion—he is anti-egalitarian. A page on his Web site Pastors.com, a resource for his fellow Christian leaders, features a woman named Beth Moore explaining and even celebrating the necessity of wifely submission. “God granted women a measure of freedom in submission that we can learn to enjoy,” she explains. “It is a relief to know that as a wife and mother I am not totally responsible for my family. I have a husband to look to for counsel and direction. I can rely on his toughness when I am too soft and his logic when I am too emotional.”
The point is not that Obama believes this stuff, or even that he should only surround himself with liberal spiritual advisers. But his inauguration is supposed to be a celebration of concord, of transcendence of the divisive culture war politics of the last eight years. By choosing Warren, he is suggesting that Warren’s positions on gay people, women and Jews aren’t really that bad, and that he can be a unifying force in American life. Whether Obama intends to or not, he’s pulling a Sister Souljah on some of his most ardent backers, writing them out of the American mainstream at precisely the time when, thanks to his election, they were so dearly hoping to reenter it.
Now, many are trying to get Obama to drop Warren. The comments on Change.gov, the Obama transition Web site, are full of heartbreak and disenchantment. At midday on Thursday, the very first of them read:
Saddened, betrayed, disappointed—I have to echo the comments of so many here. I feel a real loss this morning as I take in this news about Warren. Mr. Obama, I had such hope. On the night of your election, I waited anxiously and ultimately celebrated with a group of family and friends of all backgrounds and orientations. We felt that finally, people like us, people of intellect, creativity, and thoughtfulness, had a real voice again. If this is an example of what we can expect from your administration, then you made a fool of me.
Insulting your supporters to win the support of your opponents is no way to build unity.
- - Michelle Goldberg
Diogenes
· 1 year ago
Now Markos knows how the Naderites felt when he told them to eff off. Obama just told Markos and pro-choice, pro-gay-rights supporters the same thing.
I've voted for the Democratic candidate in every presidential election since I came of age in '76. I think 2012 will probably break that streak.
Bostonian_Queer_in_Dallas
· 1 year ago
My rentboy friends tell me that the Rick Warren's and the James Dobson's make the very hottest clientele. All that pent up rage and frustration and every Thursday at 2PM they get that all taken care of for $250 per hour. If we could somehow, I don't know how, create a massive trust fund for retiring male hookers to publish their blackbooks (well nowadays their email lists), we could shut down this fag-hating fund raising shit for good. It's one thing to be on the downlow behind your wife's back. It's quite another to do it and then work against my civil rights.
Don't forget the TWO busiest weeks in Dallas for the rentboys were when the Southern Baptist Convention and the Conference of Catholic Bishops were in town in 2001. My buddies had to call in reinforcements from Houston and Austin to keep up with the business.
ShirleyGoodnessanMercy
· 1 year ago
I believe Obama when he says he wants equality and justice for gay citizens.
But straight people (aside from 5 or 6 of them) are STUPID. We have to yell at them now and then.
And now is the time to yell at Obama. Just as black people have needed to yell at us clueless white people now and then. If you don''t walk in the Shoes, you don't know a lot of things you need to know to avoid making stupid mistakes. No matter how good your intentions are.
tomalhe
· 1 year ago
Hello ... Obama had anti-gay "pretend cured" gay DONNIE MCCLURKIN stumping on the campaign trail. And never really apologized 4 that.
All Comments
Even though the Democrats are more likely to help you reach your goals than the Republicans, it is by no means certain.
You have to constantly fight for your cause, no matter which party is in the White House or Congress.
You mean actually do our part in our democracy?
What a sell out Barry turns out to be.
Four "Barrys" in one posting.
something I can't claim for myself.
http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,859...
Yes, it is at time.com. Even the MSM is starting to see that Obama is a homophobic douche who loves gay money but hates gay people.
http://lesbianlife.about.com/od/lesbianactivism...
Barack Obama and Gay Rights in Illinois:
Barack Obama supported gay rights during his Illinois Senate tenure. He sponsored legislation in Illinois that would ban discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.
Barack Obama in the United States Senate:
Every two years the Human Rights Campaign, the largest national gay and lesbian organization, issues a scorecard for members of the Senate based on their sponsorship and voting on key issues of importance to gay and lesbian citizens. Barack Obama scored 89 out of 100% in the 2006 scorecard. Here’s how HRC rated Barack Obama:
Barack Obama on Hate Crimes:
Barack Obama co-sponsored legislation to expand federal hate crimes laws to include crimes perpetrated because of sexual orientation and gender identity.
Employment Non-Discrimination:
Barack Obama supports the Employment Non-Discrimination Act and believes it should be expanded to include sexual orientation and gender identity.
Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell – Gays in the Military:
Barack Obama believes we need to repeal the “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” policy and allow gays and lesbians to serve openly in the military. His campaign literature says, “The key test for military service should be patriotism, a sense of duty, and a willingness to serve.”
Gay & Lesbian Adoption:
Barack Obama believes gays and lesbians should have the same rights to adopt children as heterosexuals.
Barack Obama and Gay Marriage/ Civil Unions:
Although Barack Obama has said that he supports civil unions, he is against gay marriage. In an interview with the Chicago Daily Tribune, Obama said, “I’m a Christian. And so, although I try not to have my religious beliefs dominate or determine my political views on this issue, I do believe that tradition, and my religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman.”
Barack Obama did vote against a Federal Marriage Amendment and opposed the Defense of Marriage Act in 1996.
He said he would support civil unions between gay and lesbian couples, as well as letting individual states determine if marriage between gay and lesbian couples should be legalized.
“Giving them a set of basic rights would allow them to experience their relationship and live their lives in a way that doesn’t cause discrimination,” Obama said. “I think it is the right balance to strike in this society.”
h/t from John Cole's Balloon Juice. Says everything that needs to be said IMHO.
There comes a time when you have to do what's right and standing up to these bigots hiding behind religion is what is right.
Girls, love to all. I too have had enough slaps in the face from BHO and he hasn't even taken office yet. Rick Warren is a fat bloated turd -- who hates me and friends for being who we are. and there is ms. obama kissing her fat booty -- shame!!!!
this is not change -- this is hate!!!! gay is the new black, girls. it is going to be a bumpy 4 years!!!
happy holidays, girls. we have been kicked before; and yes, we always get up and shine!!!
He/she is a regular.
I've been out as a dyke since 1978. I've marched on DC 3 times: 1979 (euphoria), 1988 (height of the plague), and 1983 (right around when cocktails started saving lives). I've been disowned by my family several times, watched Reagan ignore AIDS and worse while so many beloved friends and family died, navigated a nightmare "divorce" without the benefit of the legal structure that benefits hets, adopted three black kids before it was trendy, and went through my 30s and 40s without the domestic partner benefits that so many now enjoy.
And frankly, I couldn't care less that Warren is speaking. I applaud the lgbt/queer community for taking responsibility for itself, for keeping the pressure on, for not relying on anyone else.
And....
Can we please do it without the victim crap? It is what it is. Get to work. And don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.
Give me a break and how about getting angry at the impotent national LGBT organizations in stopping things like Prop 8 (going on vacation while the Mormons eat our lunch, WTF?!?).
Apparently, gays aren't part of the United States, or at least, not quite as much as other people.
A lot of the LGBT community got "sweet talked" by Mr. Smooth. Like many men on the downlow, they get what they want from the gays, then bash our heads in. In Downlowbama's case, he just threw us under the bus, while proclaiming his love.
Ugh. He sickens me.
Seems to me that a lot of people on the left were furious that Obama didn't attack the McCain campaign, and it turned out Obama knew exactly what he was doing. I think he knows exactly what he's doing here, and it has nothing to do with Obama lying or going back on his word. It's tactics versus strategy again, and Obama is a brilliant strategist.
well, he did win. but, it's not neccesarity the best move, imo theoritically, you would need to go back in time and see what happens after trying the attack. I think he still would have won, and we would be better off if he had attacked. It would have educated people for 1 thing..
I hope the LGBT community is encouraged by how many allies you have within the grassroots Democratic Party. We can change it from the bottom up.
It's breathtaking how quickly we've become jilted lovers even before he's actually the President! Ugh.
How can Caroline support a gay-basher in the White House and expect to be the junior senator from New York? She can't.
As for David Duke, why not invite him to give his views on Dr. King's contribution to post-Confederate Southern culture on MLK Day? It's come to that. And who brought it on? Mr. Obama brought it on.
Not a good feeling, nor a good start (pre-start) to Obama's presidency.
I wish people would stop making up excuses for Obama, he has to say those things, he has to build consensus, he really believes we deserve equal rights. Bull. What we needed is a leader who is willing to be the example and do the right thing and what we got is a brilliant strategist. It's worked out well for him, but we are once again left behind.
As a community we have caved too many times. But on a good note....I attended a rural Georgia County Democratic meeting tonight. When the name Rick Warren came up, it was a unified groan...that is true change...and no one tried to defend Obama.
This is getting to be rabble-rousing.
Oh, and Hillary Clinton was WORSE than Obama on GLBT issues. Hillary wanted the issue of marriage to be left up to each state and also, she only wanted some parts of DOMA repealed. Obama said he wanted all of DOMA repealed. Not a lot worse than Obama, but definitely worse.
http://firedoglake.com/2008/12/18/the-warren-pr...
next FISA. instead of eating his wheaties and getting to work in the senate - he said he'd keep his eyes on it when he became President. well, what if he hadn't made it? so, he responded as a candidate rather than as a Senator? THAT looked pretty half-assed to me.
here we go again.
a lot of media people crush on Warren because he believes in GRAVITy and such. big whoop.
I think more people are going to crush on Warren and this will be at least part of the reason.
I don't like it and I'm more than a little taken aback that many accuse ME of being the intolerant guy. Am I Garp beating the bad driver to be civilized? I don't think so. I think all the people who proudly raised their heads that they wouldn't sit at the table with gays have become more accepted OVERNIGHT. their bias and bigotry is being presented as a political position!
Everybody who is spanking our hands for not being cool with Warren must certainly agree - gay haters, anti-immigrant race baiters - they are just expressing valid political positions? bullshit.
this smooths off Warren's jagged edges and makes him go down America's collective throat that much smoother.
yeah, it's great hearing Obama say he's going to stand up for gays but I think he's going at it half-assed.
Obama is not doing this. He has invited a gay bashing homophobe, so the question is, why isn't he inviting a Jew hating neo-nazi or a white supremicist. hatred of a minority is hatred of a minority whether they be gay, black, jewish, or whatever. it's not about race. it's about being fair and believing in the equality of ALL minorities.
Taking your comments one step further... On Inauguration Day there is a GLBT (unofficial) ball. The organizers of this event should make the biggest stink possible about the Warren choice, and turn the ball into a "protest event", and invite lots of press. And then the talent that's hired should continually and unremittingly attack Obama's betrayal of the community and his implicit endorsement of the removal of our rights. How can we make this happen? Who has the contacts?
The other route to take is to flood the Obama web site with comments condemning this choice.
Together, these actions could keep his feet held to the fire.
If we constantly yell about EVERYTHING we lose credibility when we have serious policy or governing issues with Obama.
Give the man a chance to do his best as president then pass judgment.
Your kind of putting the chicken ahead of the egg in this situation.
This president is not a friend of the gay community. His selection of Rick Warren is tantamount to condoning racism.
The religious right does it even with politicians who suppor them. We need to do it with those who support us.
John, Amen! Is the same point I was trying to make over at Balloon-Juice. We who are upset and complaining are considered "wankers" there.
No waiting. Only fighting back.
Keeping Gates, going soft on pulling out of Iraq, voting for FISA, Hillary as Sec'y of State, now this.
If you want change you should check your pockets. It aint gonna come from Washington.
AND HE WON! What a wonderful day that was. What a wonderful feeling. A distinct promise of CHANGE was coming our way. Finally.
But lately, bad economic news has been putting a damper on inauguration day, (for me anyways). I was hoping for a sunny day and a record-breaking attendance. A joyful time, in deed!
Now, I feel like I've just been uninvited. I feel like a fool.
And I've got all these people standing around me, telling me to shut the hell up and stop complaining.
Great country, huh?
Obama is a homophobic douche who loves gay money but hates gay people.
What on earth makes you say such a hateful and untrue thing?
Maybe it's my age, but the awful comments here make me wonder why I've spent so much time over the past 15 years sticking my neck out by speaking up for tolerance and acceptanceof gays in a VERY intolerant part of the country.
It seems to me that some people here have become exactly what they claim they hate.
For most of you, I'm old enough to be your grandfather. Your hatred has made me feel very, very sad. Right now, I'm ready to throw in the towel. Why bother?
You think you've had it bad. Walk a mile in our "pumps".
US balks at backing condemnation of anti-gay laws
Alone among major Western nations, the United States has refused to sign a declaration presented Thursday at the United Nations calling for worldwide decriminalization of homosexuality.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/...
The US is choosing to stand firm in solidarity with gay-executing Muslim nations. Remember when some on the right side of the aisle argued that one of the reasons for being in Iraq was to bring a stop to this practice?
Hypocrites.
Religion Dispatches:
http://www.religiondispatches.org/archive/878
Obama’s Divisive Choice of Rick Warren
By Michelle Goldberg
December 18, 2008
Warren is something of a magician. He has convinced much of the media and many influential Democrats that he represents a new, more centrist breed of evangelical with a broader agenda than the old religious right. This is, in many ways, deceptive. Yes, Warren has done a lot of work on AIDS in Africa, but he supports the same types of destructive, abstinence-only policies as the Bush administration. One of his protegés, Ugandan pastor Martin Ssempa, has been a major force in moving that country away from its lifesaving safer-sex programs. He’s been known to burn condoms at Makerere University, the prestigious school in Uganda’s capital, and in his Pentecostal services, marked by much sobbing and speaking in tongues, he offers the promise of faith healing to his desperate congregants, a particularly cruel ruse in a country ravaged by HIV.
The truth is that the primary difference between Warren and, say, James Dobson is the former’s penchant for Hawaiian shirts. [...] Speaking to the Wall Street Journal earlier this year, Warren himself described his differences with Dobson as “mainly a matter of tone,” and was unable to come up with a theological issue on which they disagree.
If Democrats collaborate in positioning Warren as the centrist alternative to the religious right, they consign vast numbers of people, including many of the party’s most dedicated supporters, to the fringe. “It does strengthen Warren as kind of a new Billy Graham figure,” says the Reverend Dan Schultz, a United Church of Christ pastor and the founder of the progressive religious blog Street Prophets. That has especial relevance for Warren’s role in Africa, where a very conservative kind of evangelical Christianity is exploding, bringing with it virulently anti-gay politics. “What I have heard is that it will help Warren overseas,” Schultz says of Warren’s role in the inauguration. “He’s big into work in Africa. This will give him a lot of clout over there. Part of the reason this is kind of insulting for me is that Warren has supported some pretty awful people in Africa, including people who think homosexuals should be jailed.”
[...]
“This is not a gay issue, this is not about abortion, it’s about every aspect of sexual equality and dignity,” says the feminist writer and philosopher Linda Hirshman. “This is about every woman who supported the president-elect, not just the gay ones and not just the ones needing abortions.” After all, Warren is not just anti-abortion—he is anti-egalitarian. A page on his Web site Pastors.com, a resource for his fellow Christian leaders, features a woman named Beth Moore explaining and even celebrating the necessity of wifely submission. “God granted women a measure of freedom in submission that we can learn to enjoy,” she explains. “It is a relief to know that as a wife and mother I am not totally responsible for my family. I have a husband to look to for counsel and direction. I can rely on his toughness when I am too soft and his logic when I am too emotional.”
The point is not that Obama believes this stuff, or even that he should only surround himself with liberal spiritual advisers. But his inauguration is supposed to be a celebration of concord, of transcendence of the divisive culture war politics of the last eight years. By choosing Warren, he is suggesting that Warren’s positions on gay people, women and Jews aren’t really that bad, and that he can be a unifying force in American life. Whether Obama intends to or not, he’s pulling a Sister Souljah on some of his most ardent backers, writing them out of the American mainstream at precisely the time when, thanks to his election, they were so dearly hoping to reenter it.
Now, many are trying to get Obama to drop Warren. The comments on Change.gov, the Obama transition Web site, are full of heartbreak and disenchantment. At midday on Thursday, the very first of them read:
Saddened, betrayed, disappointed—I have to echo the comments of so many here. I feel a real loss this morning as I take in this news about Warren. Mr. Obama, I had such hope. On the night of your election, I waited anxiously and ultimately celebrated with a group of family and friends of all backgrounds and orientations. We felt that finally, people like us, people of intellect, creativity, and thoughtfulness, had a real voice again. If this is an example of what we can expect from your administration, then you made a fool of me.
Insulting your supporters to win the support of your opponents is no way to build unity.
- - Michelle Goldberg
I've voted for the Democratic candidate in every presidential election since I came of age in '76. I think 2012 will probably break that streak.
Don't forget the TWO busiest weeks in Dallas for the rentboys were when the Southern Baptist Convention and the Conference of Catholic Bishops were in town in 2001. My buddies had to call in reinforcements from Houston and Austin to keep up with the business.
But straight people (aside from 5 or 6 of them) are STUPID. We have to yell at them now and then.
And now is the time to yell at Obama. Just as black people have needed to yell at us clueless white people now and then. If you don''t walk in the Shoes, you don't know a lot of things you need to know to avoid making stupid mistakes. No matter how good your intentions are.