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Although I know religion brings comfort to many, it is SO CRAZY!!! I can't believe these people take any this seriously.
;)
http://www.nowpublic.com/tech-biz/another-aig-b...
Or more to the point, what is wrong with our useless Senators and Reps to allow this behavior to continue?
I'm sorry, but believing that a stranger saying something mystical and doing some ritual actually affects another person (as in converting their religion), is basically believing in "spells" and "curses" which are mystical sayings and ritual performed to cause action on people at a distance.
I assume you were being facetious, but it kind of comes of as superstitious instead. There can be a fine line at times between religion and superstition and this idea of forced conversion of the dead seems to cross that line to superstition.
Oh, honey, there is no line there. Never has been--fine or otherwise.
Man, that sounds like a religion with low self-esteeem. Can't God just ignore the Mormans attempts to convert the Jews?
I think I'm not following some basic premise that is assumed here.
For Christians, esp. during the Middle Ages, the conversion of a Jewish woman was seen as a "major win", as Judaism is Matrilineal. Convert her, cut a branch from the tree. I understand, and respect your point of view, if you choose to not believe, that is your choice. But, it's an insult to the living. and to the dead. You may not care, but there are those who do. Ridicule the Mormons, but please do not ridicule their targets.
Thanks
as a more modern example, Catholics couldn't marry Protestants without facing repercussions from family or the Church - Protestants at the time were still considered heretics, for breaking from Rome. While the family considered it as bad as "marrying outside the race" back in the 1950's/60's one just didn't marry outside the religion.
They, the Mormons, have no right to baptize you after death - it is a complete lack of respect for your belief.
Amish on meth with a dollop of enhanced sexual neurosis and a big choir.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mR81PGlBeqE
Here's magick spell to make them disappear:
M o r m o n
m o r m o
o r m o
r m
o
Poof!
The problem for other religions, the Mormons are compelled to convert, it is part of the mission given to them by angel Nephi.. Their proselytzing is the foundation of the religion.
Me? Don't care since I'm a non-believing heathen, anyway.
I recall they had guests super early in the morning, every morning, only to realize now it was their religious thingy.
She invited me to her church's basketball games, man oh man white dues can NOT jump!
When the heirarchy moved her family to NY I was crushed.
John-
Was wondering if you know if anyone is looking into how the State of California is going to "defend" the lawsuit challenging Prop 8. The suit names the State Registrar, Director of Public Health, Deputy Director of Health Information and Strategic Planning, and the Attorney General. The Governor has already gone on record hoping the CA Supreme Court declares the proposition unconstitutional. Will the State of California defend against the lawsuit? If so, to what extent?
And apologies for putting this up in an unrelated thread. I didn't see a way to email you individually.
Thanks!
americablog@starpower.net
Nothing else prevents intolerance quite like that does.
I wonder if good old Falwell has been newly baptized into the LDS church.
As a non theist, I could give a shit, but I'm pretty sure people of other faiths might get a little pissed.
Here's my question: why don't they just change the baptism by proxy to include the living? Then they wouldn't have to spend so much time hunting down and converting people, they could just baptize them by proxy into the church and be done with it. Send the poor unsuspecting schmucks letters notifying them of their conversion and informing them of their local ward and the address of where to send the tithing.
I'm surprised someone hasn't thought of this before. Beats the hell out of lugging all those copies of "The Book of Mormon" from door to door.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/...
11-09) 20:02 PST -- Months before the first ads would run on Proposition 8, San Francisco Catholic Archbishop George Niederauer reached out to a group he knew well, Mormons.
Niederauer had made critical inroads into improving Catholic-Mormon relations while he was Bishop of Salt Lake City for 11 years. And now he asked them for help on Prop. 8, the ballot measure that sought to ban same-sex marriages in California.
The June letter from Niederauer drew in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and proved to be a critical move in building a multi-religious coalition - the backbone of the fundraising, organizing and voting support for the successful ballot measure. By bringing together Mormons and Catholics, Niederauer would align the two most powerful religious institutions in the Prop. 8 battle.
Vet's and Nursing homes nationwide are in need of volunteers
Food Banks and Soup Kitchens everywhere need help, food, and funds
Big Brothers and Big Sisters of America are always looking for people
The Salvation Army needs funding
Doctors Without Borders are calling for donations
The homeless population grows from coast to coast
Animal shelters need supplies and kind folks
The Red Cross needs blood
Habitat for Humanity could use a few good workers
Free clinics all over are overloaded with their need list
Young mothers and families need daycare
AND ALL THESE ASSES CAN THINK OF TO DO IS ''BAPTIZE'' DEAD PEOPLE????
If G-d weren't so busy, he'd smite these cretins with one exhale
edit:
Actually, I think it was taught to me that God himself was the father of Jesus. And that far away planet, Kolob? Big name in Mormon owned businesses. I have a friend who currently works for a church-owned credit union named Kolob.
A favorite Mormon song, sung often in my childhood home: "If you could hie to Kolob..."
http://nowscape.com/mormon/kolob-hi.htm
Put aside the commentary at the end which is biased, but the facts as presented in the animated portion are dead on accurate.
First: The nut-jobs doing the baptizing.
Second: The ones that are so aghast at the nut-jobs for doing it.
Third: Where and how exactly would this effect anything, seriously.
Fourth: It really does confirm that the Mormon Cult is actually a cult.
Fifth: The Flying Spaghetti Monster says the only real sinners are the Pastafarians.
There are no gods, there is no God.
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/showbiz/article-2...
And then there's:
http://www.marieosmond.com/Dolls/tabid/74/Defau...
i think it's bullshit.
my parents (lapsed catholics, like me) – and my wife's parents (non-observant jews, as is she) – are dead, so they don't give a shit.
meanwhile, armenian orthodox monks and greek orthodox monks are beating the snot out of each other in jerusalem.
ain't religion wonderful?
They claim that the UN is about to declare Christianity a cult and make it's practice subject to whatever whims the local flavor of homicidal madness should prescribe for advocating Christianity.
They also claim to be the legal warriors of christ and the sole defenders of Christianity on a global legal scale
Yeah...I sat there shaking my head as I listened to the pitch. Truly a gripping tale of hucksterism.
They claim the Holy War with Islam will happen next year....batty folks.
Sounds kind of cultlike to me but then I have seen a flying saucer!
But I'm not sure why anybody would care about their voodoo conversions.
Maybe it's just me, but it seems like you'd have to buy into their psycho mumbo jumbo to take it seriously.
I assume there must be some real-world fall-out for people to be concerned about this?
Wait, maybe we should leave Mormon underwear out of this;) Ah hells no, temple garments are too fun not to make fun of.
I think the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster should add this to their rituals. *I* shall add it: from now on, all Mormons including their relatives AND their underwear, are hereby inducted into the CotFSM. When they are in Spaghetti Heaven however they must sit at the back of the Heavenly Bowl and not be allowed to intermingle in the Holy Sauce.
That'll show 'em!
--Archie Bunker
Its pretty out there...
http://www.mormonstoday.com/011207/P2RMaughan01...
Apparently, the best thing to do is to have it in one's last will and testament that one's heirs have the authority to take the LDS to court if they perform post-mortem baptism. There was discussion of this practice (a major dis if ever there was one) in an article in the New York Times a couple of years ago, that ran around the time the LDS opened a temple in the Lincoln Center area in Manhattan.
Incredible, the nerve of this religion!
Then again, these are the same folks who believe that any marriage a Mormon enters into is not until death do they part, but for all eternity. I have no problem with someone's goofy romantic notions, but it is troubling that they go out of their way to redefine conventions and try to impose their beliefs on others.
There are plenty of lovely people in every religious and irreligious community. But the power-freaks ruin it for the rest of us, and they should be called out on their bullshit, and the veil of mystery should be torn away. One of the best ways of confronting our fears is to look at them directly and laugh, not stopping until everyone else sees how absurd they are. In order to do this, those things must be exposed and held up for all the world to behold.
complications among the dearly beloved left behind.
I don't believe they can do what they think they can do, but you need to sit down and think about a group of people who spend their time baptizing DEAD PEOPLE! There's nothing better to do?
I think my response would be, "Get the fuck away from me".
was a "heathen" and 'way more fun), you can but imagine how bereft I felt
when she'd first told me of her conversion! But I figured that the bond
would stand the test (also, she'd been living in TX for 20 years, and I've
stayed in NJ for the most part)--of course I was mistaken in thinking that
a brilliant person would come around to being human--there has been some
estrangement. The offhand remark about baptizing the dead just stopped me
in my tracks--I thought that was the craziest thing yet. Admit that I acted
like I didn't hear it right.
The following year I got an email from her--send the birthdays of all your
family members, etc, as she's starting a "birthday club". There was no way
I was getting involved with that scam--that was when I told my daughter
that I would have her "auntie" in court before I'd put up with that crazy
shit. I'm not a religious person, but I won't have anyone disrespecting who
and what I am, or who my parents are, especially when we are not around any
longer to speak for ourselves.
As I mentioned--I told my daughter that I'd have her drag her batshit crazy
auntie into court over it, and my daughter's reaction was that if Auntie
pulled that sort of stunt, that she would take it upon herself to visit her
auntie and tatoo a pentagram on her head for her troubles.
*g* I sure do love my kid! Makes me feel like I did something right after
all!
experienced it yourself. I guess it's worse when it's a friend who is aware
that you remember where the skeletons are, even if you're not about to
disclose their locations.
She just chose this path--it's up to her to get right with herself, and
this is how she chose to try. IMO--a tremendous waste, but I'm not her, so
vaya con dios, chickie!
I'll look up some more religions later and make you members of them. You seem to take the idea that another group of people can change your faith for you seriously, so I'll go ahead and play with it for you some more. I'm laughing at the idea of forced baptism, forced posthumous baptism more, and your apparently non-satirical outrage most.
On the plus side, they have spent a fortune building a hell of a genealogical library to do this nonsense, and it's open to anyone as far as I know. My sister's used it a bunch of times.
We who believe in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints believe that we all exist after we die. If ours is the true church, which we believe it is, we want all to enjoy it's blessings. Seeing as baptism (as you will find it is in most every church that practices it, not just ours) is a physical ordinance, it can only be perfomed on the earth. So those who didn't get a chance to hear our message in this life get a chance in the next (once again, this is what we believe, you don't have to). And we perform that baptismal ordinance so they can join our church in the afterlife if they want to. Stress on if they want to. We can't force anyone to join our church. They choose.
Once again, we believe that baptising for the dead simply gives those who didn't have a chance to join our church in this life a chance to join in the afterlife. If you don't believe in our church or in the afterlife you have nothing to worry about-we won't make you a member of our church against your will.
oh please Mary.
I've heard the message of your "church" in this life. I've seen the love of your "church" in action. I have ZERO buying impulse to join it in this life, or the afterlife. Please put me on your Do Not Baptize list. Thanks and best regards.
(I do appreciate the respectful explanation and will take it at face value, and I know and actually like more than a few individual Mormons, living here in Las Vegas, the Mecca of Jack Mormonism. But I'll also appreciate being left alone by the organization. Again, thanks.)
I could care less, as they are all a bunch of frauds. Let them do what they want, it's all useless activity.
Keeps the idiots occupied.
I used to work with a redneck Mormon, who always used to glom onto any old computers being dumped by the office, saying his church used them for "geneological research."
Now I know what he was up to.
By the way, you might like to know: if you have ever known anyone who has died, I have just now, at this very moment, redeemed their souls, by clapping my hands five times.
George Romney--Probably likes tall guys.
The Mormons have proxies for their baptisms, and I am straight (and already
married).
So I need to recruit some proxies to get married on their behalf and write
up the results so we can all share and enjoy.
I'm thinking that any mor(m)on missionaries spreading the word in WeHo or San Fran better be ready to defend themselves.
<pictures a little pray bashing>
And even to Mormons, this isn't baptism 'against anyone's will'. The ordinance is performed as a 'place holder', the 'spirit', in LDS theology, can accept it or reject the ordinance. The people are made members of the church or 'baptized' without 'permission'.
This criticism seems overboard, somewhat bigoted and definitely ignorant.
And I'm not a Mormon (former-Mormon) and gay and married to my husband, a marriage they just fought to eliminate. I'm angry and criticize the church, but John is going WAY overboard on this.
http://www.familysearch.org/ENG/search/igi/sear...
________________________________
http://liberalmuckraker.blogspot.com/
________________________________
As Mark Twain said: History doesn't repeat itself, but it does rhyme.
-S
I get saved and don't have to tithe, save two years of food or wear funny underwear!
You know what is the most ironic thing? Is that the same social system that allows Mormonism to exist in this country is one and the same that they despise and want to undermine any way that they can.
The Mormons probably hold a meeting every week to brainstorm ways of how they can be disrespectful to any other groups, religious or otherwise.
If their religion is wrong, why do you care if they baptize your dead spirit? What do you care?
If their religion is right, you should be GRATEFUL!
(Are you secretly a believer and don't want to admit it?) ROFL
Its not only a dead spirit baptize, its more than that, its erasing its data history from the real history and claiming these names as mormon religion names and erasing their past.
Take it as theft identity, I mean, would you like your grandchildren to find out that your parents where buddhist?
and that they couldnt find ANY information on the religion you belonged to?
"''Baptism of a Jewish Holocaust victim and then merely removing that name from the database is just not acceptable'- says Michel"
The guy is upset that they had the ordinance in their name in the first place. He thinks that taking their name off the registry isn't "good enough", what does he want them to do, excommunicate them posthumously? Can they apostatize posthumously? LOL
It is all silly. To worry about that is ridiculous. It has nothing to do with "conversion" or even their heritage as practicing Jews. And it definitely does not affect their heritage as Holocaust victims. At least it doesn't in my view, and I was born a Mormon believer.
The theory behind it is the founder of the Church, Joseph Smith's older brother died before Joseph had the authority to baptize, and we believe that all who are converted MUST be baptized in the flesh. You can be converted to the faith after you die, but you can't be baptized without a body of flesh and blood. So for those who are converted in heaven, they have to have someone here who hasn't died yet to be baptized "by proxy", or use the deceased persons name and be baptized for them.
The only place they are even registered, is on the Mormon Church records. Not in any other records whatsoever. And they are not even listed as "Mormon", or "converted". they only list their name as "baptism work done". And part of the reason they do that, is to not baptize them TOO many times! (The story is Charlie Chaplin has been baptized at least a dozen times) LOL
Is the game insulting and lacking in respect for the religions and beliefs of others? Of course. However, like a children's game, Mormonism and their strange beliefs about posthumous baptism are meaningless in the larger scheme of things.