DISQUS

AMERICAblog: Obama is right - US needs to digitalize health care records

  • PrahaPartizan · 11 months ago
    It won't come cheap. Worse, something like a third of US hospitals are bleeding to death financially because of the lack of national health insurance. That's only going to get worse with the continuing economic malaise and people losing their jobs (and health insurance). How are hospitals just scraping by now expected to pony up $25 million per year over the next five years to put in the new software, hardware, implementation and training without writing their own death warrants. Nobody wants to hear it and nobody wants to pay for it.
  • Bush Bites · 11 months ago
    The government will have to pay for it.

    And they are issuing grants here and there for different health care systems to set up Electronic Health Records systems.

    But the funding has to be scaled up greatly now.

    It's part of Obama's stimulus package that folks here keep deriding..
  • red_dwarf · 11 months ago
    While we're at it, lets switch over to the metric system. Jefferson and other founding fathers argued this back in the 1780s. The US spends billions every year because our system of weights and measurements are not compatible with the rest of the world (I think we're the only ones left not on the metric system). At some point in time we're going to have to do this. Putting it off will only make things worse. But then, perhaps a few billion a year in non-compatible expense is worth it so we can continue to use "feet" instead of "meters".

    W.r.t. digitizing records - is there really a question here? Procrastination to move in the right direction will continue to become more and more expensive. Get it on down the road folks.
  • DR · 11 months ago
    Agreed. I work as a senior sofware architect in the Insurance industry, and I can tell you first hand that such an endeavour is a multi-year, painful and costly one, but one which cannot be pushed back any further. BUT you simple cannot allow yourselves to:

    1. outsource any part of it to India. You'll never see the end of the project. Indian outsourcing firms tend to use underpaid, undertrained "code monkeys" instead of talented developers; most talented developers from India try to leave and work for firms which treat them better...

    2. Same goes for South Africa, where, because of an effective unemployment rate hovering around 60%, firms tend to believe that programmers are interchangeable and a highly perishable commodity.

    Use American talent (there's a hell of a lot of it), and be willing to pay more for it. The government is likely to get most of its investment back in the form not only of direct income taxes, but also on various other taxes derived from the increase in consumption which would be the result of such an investment. We all know what good consumers programmers are...
  • Peter Waksman · 11 months ago
    "Digitize" is not the correct verb. We need to put medical records online. Google is already running a prototype in Cleveland. May I propose is that the Government needs to encourage data/content standards and let Google continue its work but with some stimulating competition from other software and health care vendors.
  • Bush Bites · 11 months ago
    Yeah, that's a good point.

    There are some consortiums out there working on equipment and security standards.

    That has to be nailed down first.
  • Indigo · 11 months ago
    That would be a wise and sensible step forward. The public will never allow that! Remember when . . . the U.S. went metric in the mid-70s. Then went back. I'm telling you, the American medical profession is not ready to give up parchment and quills for record keeping. They're so elegant to use, you know.
  • Ceht · 11 months ago
    Once medical records are digitized they will be shared/archived/hacked and will never by private again.
  • J. Elsome · 11 months ago
    Between hackers* and the insurance industry, digitized records are the *worst* idea ever. Until security can be absolutely guaranteed, this is going nowhere.

    *I trust the hackers more than the insurance industry.
  • Bush Bites · 11 months ago
    Your records can be hacked now.

    It happens to hospitals all the time.
  • tbhull · 11 months ago
    Security can never be absolutely guaranteed.
  • KarenMrsLloydRichards · 11 months ago
    Obama keeps touting this as a panacea. It isn't.

    Get a single-payer NATIONAL health care system in place. Then worry about the paperwork.
  • JohnInTexas · 11 months ago
    Paperless/electronic medical records have been around for a long time and improved significantly. A govt database with everyone's health information is NOT a good idea, and that's what Bush (and apparently Obama) would like, however they want to word it. I'm not sure where all these statistics are coming from, but they almost sound like numbers from about 15 years ago or even longer.
  • Randy · 11 months ago
    There is already a hugh medical database "in the sky", but it's run by the insurance companies. Ever heard of the MIB -- Medical Information Bureau!
  • Bush Bites · 11 months ago
    You want to know why implementation is so slow?

    1. Cost

    2. Try getting doctors to them.
  • JohnInTexas · 11 months ago
    All outsourcing out of the country of ANY medical-related information, medical records, billing information, etc., needs to be stopped completely first.
  • SCLiberal · 11 months ago
    "Having watched some of the nationalized systems in Europe (from an IT perspective) this makes sense"
    Is it possible this could be a stealthy prelude to nationalizing the U.S. system? Be still my beating heart!
    I'd love to see this done for two reasons. 1. There is no such thing as privacy right now anyway and 2. There are so many IT professionals in this country who have lost jobs to the H1B visa holders. Escort those folks back to their own countries and hire American IT workers (like my cousin who had to train his own replacement) to do the job here. Let's honor the American worker once again.
  • Bush Bites · 11 months ago
    Wikipedia has a pretty good writeup on Electronic Health Records (EHR).

    One big advantage I forgot about was elimination of duplicate tests. I can't tell you how many times people go to different doctors/clinics/hospitals and get the same test several times over.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_health_...
  • Mary Morrison · 11 months ago
    As a medical professional for almost 40 years, I can assure you that digitizing medical records is a good thing, but it is not the answer to the quality and cost issues that plague our healthcare system. The refusal of many physicians and for-profit organizations coupled with the complete lack of will to implement meaningful quality improvement that addresses both process and outcomes. So long as companies and shareholders expect and demand to make a profit off the suffering of others, medical providers of all types will squeeze patient care to accommodate that. Private sector-dominated healthcare is a failure. We should start by admitting that and taking the steps necessary to cure it. All the digitized records in the world won't put a competent and well-educated nurse at the bedside of any patient.
  • Skepticat · 11 months ago
    My HMO has had digitized records for years. I was and am somewhat uncomfortable with the privacy issues, but it has prevented some problems--conflicting medication, redundant tests, and poor communication among doctors. As I've given up on any hope of any of us having privacy anyway, it seems an efficient and doable system. However, I expect the insurance and pharmaceutical companies to abuse the information.
  • tbhull · 11 months ago
    Give up and you get what you deserve.
  • Mimikatz · 11 months ago
    If there is true universal care, then many of the privacy concerns evaporate, as insurers wouldn't be cherry picking (hopefully wouldn't even be in the picture), employers wouldn't care about effects of health conditions on health care costs (just absenteeism), etc. In short, eliminating discrimination in heealth care and covering everyone goes a long way toward obviating many privacy concerns.

    My huge HMO seems to be fully digitized, with test results and e-mail from MDs readily available on line. They use the data generated internally for research as well. There are lots of upsides.
  • tbhull · 11 months ago
    Makes me smile knowing AT&T could then access all of your records and sell them off to whomever they please with government immunity.
  • caphillprof · 11 months ago
    My biggest gripe is that the medical establishment doesn't do email. Always want a gd fax. I've been giving them hell but not getting any headway. Particularly tiresome when one is operating over 4 time zones.
  • tropicgirl · 11 months ago
    This article was written by someone who does not understand how a medical office operates. My office uses handwritten records, mainly because it is the office of an OMD. But it would literally be impossible for a freestanding practice, let alone hospitals and clinics, to be able to afford the kind of transformation an office would have to go through to do this. Who really wants this? Those are the people that should pay, not the American people. Any good doctor tries to reduce costs so that his or her patients can afford to come. Right now practices all around us lack patients. People can not afford the costs associated with even office visits. It has not been proven that this will increase the quality of care. I believe any good doctor can operate at various levels of technology. This does not even touch upon the possibility of stolen data and spying on citizens that would be all too tempting to various interests both commercial and political.
  • Daigan · 11 months ago
    And who really wants that pesky old privacy and safety anyway? I mean it's not like electronic medical records could be tampered with, changed, hacked into, fall into the wrong hands, or be spread all over the internet or anything.

    Yeah I prefer my privacy thanks.
  • Danalan · 11 months ago
    I've been implementing computerized hospital systems, including automation of medical records, for 21 years. The scope and cost of doing this nationwide in a professional, successful manner is just not possible by the current players. The current database technology is insufficient to support the complexity involved.

    The main problem is the interfacing -- much of the necessary data is already available in the hospitals billing, coding, digital imaging, and other systems. But how to integrate that all into one database? HL7 is the language of preference, but it's not used in a consistent manner. There needs to be translation tables and interface engines between all these systems and the 'electronic health record.'

    Maybe, just maybe, a huge player like Microsoft, Google, or even Yahoo could provide the necessary storage, but then who's going to implement the technology nationwide? Who's even going to train the trainers? It's unthinkable that a single entity can do this -- which means lots of contracts, which means too little standardization. It does us no good to digitize it all if the appropriate people can't access the appropriate data at the appropriate time.

    Most x-rays are digital now, and they are transferred from hospital-to-hospital on CD's through the mail. The data type, DICOM, is very standardized except for the odd Nuclear Medicine study. The studies could be transferred over the internet easily enough, except no security exists to protect this patient data, and no process is in place to do this. Would it enhance patient care? Yes -- timely access to a patients prior x-rays is a huge help in reading the current x-ray. The problem is there's no economic advantage -- it's purely a better health care metric.

    The same problem exists with the electronic medical record. It's better for the patient, but does it save money?
  • jcgraham77 · 11 months ago
    I really don't want my medical records any easier to steal than they already are. Why would a cyber thief steal your credit card info when he can blackmail you for the rest of your life with medical secrets you might not want disclosed.
    BAD IDEA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • cjg · 11 months ago
    This was not a well investigated story. In fact, it seems off the cuff. Many practices in the US are implementing electronic medical records successfully. I belong to a very large practice that has put great effort into this process. The entire practice at all levels has sacrificed time and a great deal of money to get this going. In fact, the entire city has worked closely to coordinate this process with different practices and the hospital and has worked to assist smaller practices fund this very expensive endeavor. The authors attack on physicians living in the stone ages blocking modernization is simplistic, incorrect, and childish. Take the time to do some research and write a substantial article that is helpful and informative.
  • jackb29 · 11 months ago
    First, let's not reinvent the wheel... The Veterans Administration Medical Records ALREADY are electronic. My brother is a Critical Care RN at his local VA. Records are kept on each patient by a dedicated laptop for that patient (while he/she is on the ward or in the clinic). If a covered veteran is on vacation a thousand miles away from home and becomes sick, the local VA can access the same record on him as his home VA.

    Although the VA disability system had a well deserved rep for delay and incompetence, the VA Medical care System is first class.. Once you can get into it.. Many veterans, promised this care during their service, find they dont qualify if they werent wounded or injured in service, and if they make too much money, and that level is set very low. The Bush neglect of the system hasnt helped either...

    But the electronic health record system they have developed is first rate.. lets hope we can just replicate that into a nationwide system instead of many different hospital systems all developing their own, incompatable systems...
  • jackb29 · 11 months ago
    Additional comment... My local doctor's practice has made their records electronic. He belongs to a physician's group, and he was one of the leads in developing the system.. Not all doctors are stick in the muds as far as going to electronic records...
  • cjg · 11 months ago
    The government does have quality EMR products not available to private practices. Quality EMR products for civilian practices are just becoming available now. Physicians are not sticks in the mud for wanting a quality product for this tremendous investment.
  • ndtovent · 11 months ago
    While I too want to keep my medical records private, I'm a strong proponent of digitizing all medical records/patient information and standardization. It would cut administrative costs by at least 50 percent in the long run. It's a given that most software systems can be easily hacked anyway, and complete privacy wouldn't be as much an issue if accompanying legislation were enacted providing universal health care for EVeryone, regardless of pre-existing conditions, or until then, prohibiting ALL insurance companies from excluding anyone because of pre-existing conditions, and from charging higher premiums. This would alleviate some privacy issues.
  • IAmATVJunkie · 11 months ago
    Digitizing records would be fine. Keeping them secure is the issue.

    When there are privacy leaks at every financial institute all the time, I don't know if I want my personal medical information sitting on a server ready to be hacked.
  • Randy · 11 months ago
    From a "make work" standpoint, this will never fly. Most of the IT work will almost assuredly be outsourced -- to the lowest bidder -- especially if cost becomes an object. Otherwise, the govt will have to pay to have the thing built and essentially give it to every medical facility. else, if "competition" is allowed into the game ......
  • ComradeRutherford · 11 months ago
    Oh, boy! Now it will be incredibly easy for identify thieves to steal even my medical records! Everyone will be able to my records, except me of course.
  • thisattractivemotherof3 · 11 months ago
    This is such a bad idea. Which parts of the record? The article says all. Really? Every office visit? Full History? Family history? How far back? My gyn history is not relevant to the doc who fixes my broken leg.

    I would rather see hospitals show better competency at using technology to help them better care for patients in the short term , per stay, etc, better log of meds, etc.

    If a full records system does go digital, I hope it will not be a requirement for participating in any national plan.
  • Mo · 11 months ago
    I work at a university and use their health clinics. The medical recordkeeping there is completely digital and I wouldn't want to go back to a paper system ever. My husband has a head injury and trying to rely on him for a medical history is next to impossible. Not to worry - they have it all there - the doctors can look up when his last seizure was, his history of meds changes, etc. And when he gets a new doctor, they have all of the old one's notes.

    Self-reported medical histories are a huge source of medical errors, especially in the mental health field. If we are going to treat mental illness on a parity with physical illness, we are going to need some way to verify actual patient histories, not simply their beliefs about their life stories.

    Privacy is an issue, but the current system is basically "security by obscurity." Records are safe only because they are so difficult and time consuming to obtain. The thing that is keeping them "safe" is harmful to your health.

    And you can deal with your doctor by email! And get emails reminding you that you need an checkup or test and offering you several open appointments!
  • stymie · 11 months ago
    "Computerize all health records within five years. The quality of health care for all Americans gets a big boost, and costs decline." I do not wholeheartily agree. What this might do for the positve is reduce some iatrogenic injuries/accidents. I can forsee that there would be an improvement in reducing drug prescriptions that would be contraindicated due to interactions with patients current meds.
    Develop a sysytem and philosophy where drugs then surgery are our last choices and then you'll be onto something. But there will continue to be many deaths and injuries from the delivery of an ass-backwards system of attempting to deliver health when it is really only a haphazard system of responding to health crisis.
    The health care approach by medical doctors is fucked up between their ears and will remain so for a long time. I don't see Obama changing much other than the record keeping.
  • steve303 · 11 months ago
    As someone who has worked on small (single org) EMR systems here are some sobering thought I'd like to share:

    Around 2005 the UK finally gave up on trying to institute national EMRs after spending billions of pounds. If Great Britton, with a single payer system, cannot get EMR to work properly, it is a fools errand for us -- with our multiple payers system and byzantine coding requirements -- to even attempt such a feat.

    The first stage -- long before the first record is put into a computer -- would be to set a national coding standard for ALL healthcare professions and providers; this alone would take Omaba's first term. The second thing to be done -- before any record is digitized for sharing -- would be to establish a national standard for insurance filings -- this would probably take only 2-3 years. Finally, a the enactment of a digital privacy act would be required, so records and information remain property of the patient -- given healthcare, government, and other commercial interests against such a act this would take 5 additional years.
  • Danalan · 11 months ago
    I worked for one of the prime players in this mess -- I remember a bunch of people moved to England from the Seattle office to (try and) implement the systems. Lots of time and money was spent, but the effort was unsuccessful. There was no-one forcing everybody to follow one process and standard. Even with 'one-payer' systems there is considerable difference in internal operations and reporting requirements.
  • bobmunck · 11 months ago
    Repeating what Jack said five hours ago: an excellent medical records system ALREADY EXISTS and is in widespread use. The Veterans Administration's VistA system began development over twenty years ago and is today in use all over the US and in several foreign countries. It is supported by a network of volunteers, called the "Hardhats" and is essentially what's called "open source" like the Linux operating system.

    I've worked on government software development for a number of decades and I'm quite sure that if the US attempts to start from scratch on a system like this, establishes standards, puts out RFPs for competitive bid, etc. they will spend billions of dollars, a decade or more of time, and fail completely. Adopting VistA is really the only possibility.
  • Danalan · 11 months ago
    There are several commercial systems that could easily compete with VistA, the problem with all of them is scalability. VistA has been successful because of a dedicated core of programmers and analysts on the government payroll. Much of it's vaunted technology and standards are incompatible with any other system, and expanding it from 200 hospitals to 5000 hospitals (plus another 30,000+ clinics) would be a truly Herculean task. Maybe Sisyphus is a better example, actually.