AMERICAblog: "Obama's $300 Billion Tax Cut: Lots of Buck, Not Much Bang"
FunMe
· 10 months ago
CHANGE?
Oh no, you didn't understand. I meant, we have to CHANGE who votes for us. We won. And yes we meant we gotta CHANGE who votes for Democrats. We did CHANGE - we have more people who voted us into office.
Now back to regular schedule program ... oink, oink. Where's my pork?
wearing out my F key
· 10 months ago
take all you like. we'll print more!
KerrynowCampau
· 10 months ago
"seems at odds with the notion that this is an emergency."
How many times now have we fallen for the "we have to do this immediately" cries?
I don't buy it anymore, even from Obama.
nicho
· 10 months ago
The minute some salesman tells me I have to decide immediately or lose the deal -- I walk.
scottinsf
· 10 months ago
Whatever happened to all of Obama's talk about repealing the Bush tax cuts for the richest taxpayers? Now I'm hearing they might just let them expire. WTF?!? That is two more years. I thought that was how they were going to help pay for the tax cuts for the middle-class.
He seems to believe the way to fix the economy now is to just let the money flow and worry about paying for stuff later.
Akaison
· 10 months ago
bingo. That he promised tax cuts in the campaign has nothing to do with the issues involved in the stimulus. Its dishonest to claim that it does. The tax cuts were never meant to solve this problem. i kept saying this on daily kos, but a few accolytes would not buy the argument because they have their talking points that Obama's people will keep saying. This is bushian- remember drilling for oil in Alaska. How before 9/11 it was for one reason, but after 9/11 it was for preventing terrorism? It seems this is Obama's strategy here. My problem is that the economy is in the crapper. We don't have time for these games.
Indigo
· 10 months ago
So it's really a $400B stimulus with $300B in tinsel ornaments to amuse the Jerry Springer Show fans. Okay. I get it. The ancient Romans did that with lots more glitz, it was called "Bread and Circus." Couldn't we go back to that and toss the Republicans to the hungry wild animals instead of waving around invisible tax cuts?
Bush_Bites
· 10 months ago
The stimulus bill will not pass without tax cuts.
What leads anybody to believe Harry Reid can win a vote without a sop to the Repubs?
Akaison
· 10 months ago
There is virtually no chance that this bill in some form would not pass. That's just the b.s. Democrats are spinning you with. Learn to ignore the surface, and look beneath. Oh, and while I don't like Harry Reid- Obama is the President elect. The buck stops with him for his stimulus plan. This is example of Obama's personality defect of splitting the baby rather than having direct confrontation. I found in the primary and in the GE when he got comfortable he would fall back on this shtick. It's only when he's pushed into a corner does he start to fight like he wants it. I fear that's happening here. He's going for what he think is the easy sale rather than the right answer. That's his fatal flaw. That's how the GOP will get him everytime.
paulbot5
· 10 months ago
Why do people think we need stimulus, some experts say the stimulus will prolong the agony, we need some real change in our economic system not more of the same
Bush_Bites
· 10 months ago
Such as?
paulbot5
· 10 months ago
Ending the fed, saving not spending, lowering gov spending a lot so we can end the income tax, legalize industrial hemp, hell even george washington grew hemp
nicho
· 10 months ago
Yeah and we can all grow our own food and make our own clothes. Maybe build a little water wheel outside our house for power. Jeez -- libertarian utopian claptrap.
Older_Wiser
· 10 months ago
Hear hear!! (Hey, what happened to Nicho's post? That was for his remarks.
Steve_in_CNJ
· 10 months ago
I wish you were running for Congress.
paulbot5
· 10 months ago
I just want the gov to be like how the founders wanted, lets give their ideas a chance once again it's what made America strong right?
Soundboy_jeff_meanie
· 10 months ago
Ron Paul! we were wondering where you went after you lost.
Soundboy_jeff_meanie
· 10 months ago
exactly! deregulate everything... as we've seen how well it works when American is a nation of "I'm only in it for me!".
paulbot5 is obviously a Ron Paul bot.
egad... when are the Libertarians going to realize that 'no government' is as bad as 'too much government'.
greed always fucks up the equation.
paulbot5
· 10 months ago
You cant stop greed with any amounts of laws, greed is the driving force that fuels a good economy, fear is what controls greed but all these bailouts remove the fear
KerrynowCampau
· 10 months ago
There must be a happy medium between the no and the too much.
KerrynowCampau
· 10 months ago
Maybe we don't have to make our own clothes but things definitely need to get more local.
The water wheel is a great idea! Combine that with a few solar panels. Energy independence!
KerrynowCampau
· 10 months ago
I wish you were in Congress.
lucidity
· 10 months ago
Why the hell is it a bad thing if this bill passes with only 3 or 4 Republican votes in the Senate? Come up with a bill that really supports the middle class, using progressive principles, and then let the Republicans vote against it. The stupidity of the Senate Dems is astounding.
SCLiberal
· 10 months ago
I agree. This is the perfect opportunity to shine the spotlight on the Republicans and reveal them for the obstructionists they are. The Democrats need much better PR also.
Older_Wiser
· 10 months ago
This is what happens when you have Rubin, Summers and Geithner on your economic team.
Throwing money at people so they'll "spend" does nothing for this economy, as previous tax cuts and rebates have already shown.
Every penny of that package should go to infrastructure to create JOBS, and I don't think tax rebates to small businesses are going to create those jobs, either.
The unemployment rate among young people is criminal and it creates destitution, despair and desperation. What have HS, and college, graduates got to look forward to? The HS dropout rate is growing as kids feel they need to work in families who are suffering financially, with the loss of parents' jobs, etc. and they are being dead-ended.
fastneataverage
· 10 months ago
Unfortunately we don't have the votes to pass this without some Republican support. I think (hope) that Obama is saying that it is $750B as a minimum. My thoughts are that they will give $300b in tax breaks to those making $100k or less per year, and that Congress will push a stimulus in excess of $1.2T. Then, keep the $300b in tax cuts (stop talking percentages), and the remaining $900B will be used on infrastructure, technology, green work, higher education, etc. It also will help to pacify Joe the Plumber and his fans that they're getting something on main street.
I know it sounds pie-in-the-sky, but I'm slightly optimistic. Remember, the credit market it $50T. Even $1.2T is barely 2.5%.
Akaison
· 10 months ago
BS. Sorry it just is. You are spinning like a top. And what you say , considering we don't know you from a hill of beans, compared to what real economists both conservative and liberal are saying is different from what you re saying.
paulbot5
· 10 months ago
Stimulus > printing more money > inflation > rich get richer poor get poorer
Rustyzipper
· 10 months ago
OT... Just reported, Congressman Booby Rush's office Just opened a letter with white Powder in it, also Pics of KKK.
KarenMrsLloydRichards
· 10 months ago
I want my $500 tax rebate! Spread out over 52 weeks. For my Starbucks latte and bonus Barack Obama biscotti treat.
Soundboy_jeff_meanie
· 10 months ago
is Starbucks still around in your town?? odd... they're closing stores everywhere else.
GaryBrush
· 10 months ago
Obviously the FINAL BILL will look much different from anything that Obama proposes so I am not sweating this at all. Obama knows that and that is why his speech today lacked specifics on what the bill will be about.
Steve_in_CNJ
· 10 months ago
then perhaps he should have started with $0 tax cuts and conceded a couple 100 billion in the back and forth.
Gef
· 10 months ago
Bush 3: He's BLAAaaCK.
foxy
· 10 months ago
Adult Industry Asks Govt For Stimulus Package..
"TMZ is reporting that Hustler's Larry Flynt and "Girls Gone Wild" creator Joe Francis are asking for a $5 billion federal bailout of adult entertainment because "the economy has made America's appetite for sex go limp."
The web site claims adult DVD sales are down 22 percent in a year, numbers which are sure to deflate expectations at this weekend's AVN Adult Entertainment Expo in Las Vegas. "
Are you kidding? Screw those 2...people fuck like minks when there's nothing else to do. And they don't need porn to do it.
animosity
· 10 months ago
news item
Republicans: Wary of Obama plan...
Ah!
From those wonderful folks who gave us the last depression and won't be satisfied until they gives us another...
mirth
· 10 months ago
Here are some ways to dig this country out from under and to begin the restoration of US honor:
1) Immediately and dramatically slash the pentagon budget. 2) Cease all forms of aid to the state of Israel. 3) Cease all funding of programs which spy on US citizens. 4) Prosecute Bush&Co, the whole lot of them, Republican and Democrat, private and professional (which includes the MSM) who have profited from the disaster they have created and have them personally pay reparations to we citizens.
This would be a start.
tropicgirl
· 10 months ago
I also don't think this will work.
First of all, WE pay income tax by weekly deductions (most of us). Tax rebates will not help us. The REST OF US own small businesses WHICH PAY NO TAX ( or only pay on their net, which should be 0 these days). Tax rebates will not help them. The OTHERS just get dividends which transcend taxes.
Second of all, the construction projects are just that, Construction projects. I don't know about you, but here in Florida construction projects are THE PROBLEM, not the solution. Its the same old Rezko/CRA racketeering. Ask Chicago how many residential development projects qualified for federal money claiming to be affordable housing. The city commissioners get money from the government and fund the unhealthy construction projects of their friends in the Chamber of Commerce. Almost all of our condos are empty here and they are still building more. Because they get a tax break for "affordable housing". This is the same old racket.
The truth is... gas is (was) unaffordable, cars are unaffordable, houses are unaffordable if you play by the rules, food is unaffordable, and trinkets from Macys are unnecessary and unaffordable, credit cards are unaffordable and stocks are unaffordable and risky. Thats the real truth. You can not and will not get blood out of a stone.
If you really want to help people, it needs to show up in food, gas (keeping oil shenanigans out of the market), lower weekly tax deductions, reasonable phone and cable charges (also out of control) and education money. Save the bailout money for US in the form of food stamps, unemployment and mortgage relief. All the other stuff is garbage and won't work.
The economy can't be "stimulated". Its been OVERSTIMULATED and needs to calm down and take its OWN COURSE. Just bail out the suffering individual people as best as we can. Give us a check now.
Patrick_Bateman
· 10 months ago
Sage ideas. If we could cap the credit card companies to a reasonable interest rate, many families could save possibly hundreds a month. THIS would be more to stop the bleeding than what is proposed.
cowboyneok
· 10 months ago
My take is Obama doesn't need to do anything to woo Republicans because he can never do enough. Anything he does will not be enough for them, and they will obstruct anything and everything he tries to do to make the crisis go away. Republicans have proven time and again they put politics above the health of our nation. They aren't going to make nice now. Obama better not be naive about this.
DougStamate
· 10 months ago
There seems to be an awful lot of mis-reading of the article in question. Krugman refers to an entry at TaxVox. The entry clearly mentions that the possible actions of the Obama adminstration that they are writing about are "trial balloons" being floated by staffers. In other words, there just possibly might not be any "there" there. I would like to know, though, where the idea that an increase in the tax rebate/cut was simply to ensure 80 votes in the Senate? I've seen it mentioned, but no attribution.
All Comments
Oh no, you didn't understand. I meant, we have to CHANGE who votes for us. We won. And yes we meant we gotta CHANGE who votes for Democrats. We did CHANGE - we have more people who voted us into office.
Now back to regular schedule program ... oink, oink. Where's my pork?
How many times now have we fallen for the "we have to do this immediately" cries?
I don't buy it anymore, even from Obama.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/01/08/pelosi...
What leads anybody to believe Harry Reid can win a vote without a sop to the Repubs?
paulbot5 is obviously a Ron Paul bot.
egad... when are the Libertarians going to realize that 'no government' is as bad as 'too much government'.
greed always fucks up the equation.
The water wheel is a great idea! Combine that with a few solar panels. Energy independence!
Throwing money at people so they'll "spend" does nothing for this economy, as previous tax cuts and rebates have already shown.
Every penny of that package should go to infrastructure to create JOBS, and I don't think tax rebates to small businesses are going to create those jobs, either.
The unemployment rate among young people is criminal and it creates destitution, despair and desperation. What have HS, and college, graduates got to look forward to? The HS dropout rate is growing as kids feel they need to work in families who are suffering financially, with the loss of parents' jobs, etc. and they are being dead-ended.
I know it sounds pie-in-the-sky, but I'm slightly optimistic. Remember, the credit market it $50T. Even $1.2T is barely 2.5%.
He's BLAAaaCK.
"TMZ is reporting that Hustler's Larry Flynt and "Girls Gone Wild" creator Joe Francis are asking for a $5 billion federal bailout of adult entertainment because "the economy has made America's appetite for sex go limp."
The web site claims adult DVD sales are down 22 percent in a year, numbers which are sure to deflate expectations at this weekend's AVN Adult Entertainment Expo in Las Vegas. "
http://www.cnbc.com/id/28542109
Republicans: Wary of Obama plan...
Ah!
From those wonderful folks who gave us the last depression and won't be satisfied until they gives us another...
1) Immediately and dramatically slash the pentagon budget.
2) Cease all forms of aid to the state of Israel.
3) Cease all funding of programs which spy on US citizens.
4) Prosecute Bush&Co, the whole lot of them, Republican and Democrat, private and professional (which includes the MSM) who have profited from the disaster they have created and have them personally pay reparations to we citizens.
This would be a start.
First of all, WE pay income tax by weekly deductions (most of us). Tax rebates will not help us. The REST OF US own small businesses WHICH PAY NO TAX ( or only pay on their net, which should be 0 these days). Tax rebates will not help them. The OTHERS just get dividends which transcend taxes.
Second of all, the construction projects are just that, Construction projects. I don't know about you, but here in Florida construction projects are THE PROBLEM, not the solution. Its the same old Rezko/CRA racketeering. Ask Chicago how many residential development projects qualified for federal money claiming to be affordable housing. The city commissioners get money from the government and fund the unhealthy construction projects of their friends in the Chamber of Commerce. Almost all of our condos are empty here and they are still building more. Because they get a tax break for "affordable housing". This is the same old racket.
The truth is... gas is (was) unaffordable, cars are unaffordable, houses are unaffordable if you play by the rules, food is unaffordable, and trinkets from Macys are unnecessary and unaffordable, credit cards are unaffordable and stocks are unaffordable and risky. Thats the real truth. You can not and will not get blood out of a stone.
If you really want to help people, it needs to show up in food, gas (keeping oil shenanigans out of the market), lower weekly tax deductions, reasonable phone and cable charges (also out of control) and education money. Save the bailout money for US in the form of food stamps, unemployment and mortgage relief. All the other stuff is garbage and won't work.
The economy can't be "stimulated". Its been OVERSTIMULATED and needs to calm down and take its OWN COURSE. Just bail out the suffering individual people as best as we can. Give us a check now.
In other words, there just possibly might not be any "there" there.
I would like to know, though, where the idea that an increase in the tax rebate/cut was simply to ensure 80 votes in the Senate? I've seen it mentioned, but no attribution.