AMERICAblog: Paulson (taxpayers, actually) now planning to buy Wall Street bad debt
henrythefifth
· 1 year ago
This is insanity. Seriously, we need to hire an f-ing superhero REPO MAN to head out and repossess some yachts, high rises, and vacation homes. We're supposed to spend $1-2 trillion bailing rich a-holes out, but we can't even afford to extend unemployment (those blood sucking lazy ass out of work poor people!) for 6 to 12 weeks.
Will Dems stand up to this corporate socialism? I think we'll once again see that they too have about as much spine as a jellyfish when it comes to standing up to Wall Street.
I'm sick.
vwcat
· 1 year ago
Most people are angry about the AIG bailout and people are in no mood to keep bailing these incompetent wealthy fat cats and the companies they ran into the ground out. The government could care less about us but, boy we are expected to make it easy for the greedy big shots. I am so sick and frustrated. I swear if Obama is not elected in November and we end up finding the idiots in the electorate vote in republicans again I am going to contact my family in France and leave. I refuse to stick around for the final nail in the coffin of this wacked out country and let the idiots to keep voting for republicans no matter what or how bad, let them stay and suffer for their stupidity.
bumpkis
· 1 year ago
Expat since 2003....but never thought it would get this bad.
unrepentant_expat
· 1 year ago
Expat since 1968... and I've always thought the signs were there, it was only a matter of time.
shanobama
· 1 year ago
And to think, they always 'warn' you about foreign banks when you move out of the country, sometimes risky because of lack of regulation.
BillP
· 1 year ago
So the corporate world has taken over (Fascism) and when they screw up, the people have to bail them out (Socialism).
Good work if you can get it, I guess. Would be hard to sleep at night for me though.
BP
BLOGGING BITCH!
· 1 year ago
Fine. Make Bush present us with next year's Budget then.
Boehner sure wants Obama buried in red ink before he ever gets started. So, Boehner will sign whatever hurts the most. Senator Judd Gregg has to explain how we'll pay for it. Senator Gregg is The George Bush of The Senate.
Busboy
· 1 year ago
Maybe some of us little guys may wind up owning some choice waterfront property? Who knows. Keep the powder dry....
BLOGGING BITCH!
· 1 year ago
May your be in Galvaston.
Busboy
· 1 year ago
Spellcheck?
An_American_Karol
· 1 year ago
Lol
BLOGGING BITCH!
· 1 year ago
So, we did have the money to send enough troops to begin with?
They didn't have to die in vain?
Chris From Maine
· 1 year ago
hyperinflation.. depression..
welcome to the United States of Socialist America. The government now owns several massive corporations.
Oh.. and you know what government + corporations is? FASCISM.
BLOGGING BITCH!
· 1 year ago
When were these companies last audited?
Judd Gregg always has his charts to show us how The Economy is doing. He had to know more than he's telling us.
This didn't happen overnight.
lilyannerose
· 1 year ago
Does this mean we can all default on our credit cards, car loans and mortgages?
OK, thought I'd ask.
Slim Cognito
· 1 year ago
Sounds fair to me.
anarchy
· 1 year ago
why not? you've got nothing to lose.. right?
everybody should default on any bank debt as well as refuse to pay taxes. and I mean, EVERYBODY who is pissed off about this mess they got us in. they're only going to get bailed out on our dime anyway.
ZennButtKicker (tlhwraith)
· 1 year ago
So Chris, how's the weather in Paris? I think it's about time to get on the nearest jet (while I can still afford it) and get out of the country before things really get bad around here. Even if Obama is elected, the hole the GOP has dug for this country will take generations to fix, if ever.
Busboy
· 1 year ago
Good time to leave. Where you going? Kenya? Live on a dollar a month like Obama's brother?
Bush_Bites
· 1 year ago
I heard people can live on a dollar a month in Oklahoma.
True?
Busboy
· 1 year ago
If you have a 160 acres? Then, you can do it.
Jim Olson
· 1 year ago
So, what happens when China and Saudi Arabia call their notes and want their money?
Busboy
· 1 year ago
The federal reserve prints the money and gives it to them. Next question?
Bush_Bites
· 1 year ago
Ha!
I remember when conservatives were all monetarists.
Guess nobody cares about Milton Friedman anymore, huh?
Busboy
· 1 year ago
You should have bought gold and silver when Uncle Milty told you to........
bumpkis
· 1 year ago
They get hit with internal unrest and "homegrown" terrorist attacks?
BLOGGING BITCH!
· 1 year ago
We'll then get to ask Saudi Arabia why they were harboring those that attacked us on 9/11 and also why Bush ignores this fact. Same with Egypt.
unrepentant_expat
· 1 year ago
And then again, why were all of those bin Ladens sent back on Sept. 12th 2001 without being questioned? Or was that 'what happens in the family,stays in the family'.
tbhull
· 1 year ago
...
tbhull
· 1 year ago
We have already watched and learned that not no real difference exists between repubs and dems when is comes to an unjustified and immoral war that costs taxpayers $12 billion a month (55 months deep into with no end in sight) and is rife with fraud.
We have already watched and learned that not no real difference exists between repubs and dems when is comes to warrantless intrusions into all e-mail traffic and cell phone conversations without a warrant in clear fucking violation of the 4th Amendment.
We have already weatched and learned that not no real difference exists between repubs and dems when it comes to unfettered and unchecked executive power.
It is now time to again watch and learn that no difference exists between repubs and dems when it comes to doubling, at a minimum, our deficit in a single stroke of the pen and baling out ungodly worlwide wealth, fraud and greed. e Why should anyone have any confidence that the Congress, this administration and the Fed, the same folks that fueled this crap and knew of the financial hocus pocus of leverage and did nothing, can find a resolution? This is just furtherance of the fraud on the taxpayer forever enslaving us and our descendants for generations to come.
This is when the market works most efficiently, brutally and teaches its finest lessons. Let's learn the right way. The best answer is to let corrupt and poorly ran companies and banks fail, and we will take lessons learned, though painful for a while, and rebuild anew better, leaner and cleaner.
Let see if Obama has a pair and comes out against any further bailout using taxpayer funds. Do not count on it. McCain is a whore for $$$ so he is not worth the time of day.
It is time for one or both of the candidates to come out and say fuck NO! Chances that McCain will say no:0%. Chance that Obama will say no: 0%. We will watch and learn an outcome we already know.
TomJoad
· 1 year ago
I don't buy that. The difference is the driver. When Bush and his thugs pushed for an Iraq war, lied to members of congress (and yea...from my little seat as a nobody, I KNEW it was all bullshit because of what I read, about Feith, Wolfowitz, Cheney, pounding desktops mad as hell at the CIA and FBI for not "finding "the" link between Saddam and 911, and Al Queda" and the bullshit they spewed should have made any sensible person doubt their story. But if the Vice president had taken me aside and told me in all secrecy that they had suitcase nukes, etc. I have no idea if I would doubt my judgement) and THAT WOULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED IF GORE OR KERRY were in the WH. One could argue they might have prevented 911 since there WAS warning, and even if not "specific" they could certainly have tightened airport security, etc. But let that go, on top of it all, they would have treated this as a police action, as the crime it was. Instead Bush put the screws on to take it to war, to enrich his patrons. PNAC laid it all out beforehand and oilmen...it was just waiting to happen. So, NO...they are not the same. The difference is in the climate of fear, and the illogic of scare tactics and flag pins, it would take MANY with more guts than most have, to stand up to the push for war. But don't EVER forget who drove that and made that climate that we all have to live with now. No politician with any chance of not being marginalized could demand inquiries, push for oversight, lay out for the american people what we KNEW , and call for not going to war. Some did, but the GOP controlled Congress at that time. Later, they were stuck with it.
Now we're all stuck with it.
There is most definitely a difference, and if you play the "they're all the same" card, and we get another GOP (this time McCain, we'll be at war with Spain in no time) we get more war. That's it. We get a chance for lessened war with a democrat.
lynchie
· 1 year ago
The job our elected officials take on is to protect the interests of the electorate. When there are tough choices, hard decisions, and imminent danger they have to demand the facts and act accordingly. Clinton admittted she never read the Patriot Act. She admitted she didn't understand when Bush asked for the right to declare war. She was not alone. The repubs were in lock step and so was most of America. I remember clearly the scene of the Congress running down the steps when there was an Anthrax scare. Our Congress want all the perks, the high pay, free healthcare, cusy life and the kickbacks and bribes but when it comes time to do their job and protect our interests most ran for the fucking hills. Obama did not. He voted against war measures and is now going to be President. Every single politician who was in Congress when the unravelling of oversight and regulation occurred needs to be charged with incompetence and jailed. Bailing out companies that are run in a piss poor manner is not the role of government. Let some people get layed off maybe next time they will speak up when they see things happen that are illegal. Like Enron where they all laughed at the bills being sent out for sky high electricity. Put them on the street and people will begin to understand that you can't cheat, lie and steal without behing held accountable. These same politicians who are opening the vaults also voted to remove the right for Americans to declare bankruptcy and right off their credit card debt, guaranteeing the same Banks and Investment companies the monies. They said Americans need to be accountable for their actions but the same does not apply to the richest segment of this country.
What would happen to our economy if we didn't bail them out? Would we see another Bloody Monday 1929? I honestly don't know.
tbhull
· 1 year ago
Nothing to fear but fear...
Americans need to quit being afraid of losing consumer comfort. It has a price, now and forever.
A better America could exist without current Wall Street and DC.
RJAGIELSKI1
· 1 year ago
bout time someone pointed to what could actually happen. I've been a missionary for the last 15 years and one thing I learned , it's much easier to survive in a poor country than it is to be poor in this country
lynchie
· 1 year ago
That is a brilliant comment.
tbhull
· 1 year ago
Why do you or should anyone have any confidence that the Congress, this administration and the Fed, the same folks that fueled this crap and knew of the financial hocus pocus of leverage and did nothing, can prevent a Bloody Monday 1929 with this planb.
The Fed has already spent $880 billion. The results, market chaos and the promise of another multiu-trillion dollar "plan" funded by taxpayers. Give me a fucking break! How can anyone find reason to support these bullshit failures?
cmpnwtr
· 1 year ago
A transfer of private investment banker debt to public citizens of a half trillion dollars. No way!! http://www.cnbc.com/id/26779080
Wild_Weasel
· 1 year ago
Socialism for the rich.
tbhull
· 1 year ago
This scam replinishment of wealth's wealth from classes middle and poor has happended before.
In the late 1980s S&Ls failed from fraud and greed. S&Ls made bad loans and the wealthy made off quite well on ridiculously inflated real estate. When the floor collpased and failure ensued the government used taxpayer dollars to bailout the S&Ls out and taxpayers paid the bill. What happened to all thos assets of the failed S&Ls?
Well, government established Resolution Trust Corporation (RTC) took possession of billions of dollars worth of real estate, with an eye toward selling them off say taxpayers would get their oney back. Not so fast, these assetswere sold in the cheap (pennies on the dollar) to wealth and relevered.
Screw the new RTC, as it lacks creativity (Rambo II) and only perputaes the privatize profits and socilaize losses scam. These clowns are so bold and shameless they did not even redo the gam plan. Have taxpayers grown that stupid?
The short of it: this will be the greatest transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich in the history of mankind. Big business and big government (repub and dem) - they aren't enemies, they've always been on the same side.
Wild_Weasel
· 1 year ago
Right on!
The goal of NeoCons is to transform America into another third world country, with no middle class, and a very small very rich very powerful elite.
Wild_Weasel
· 1 year ago
The collapse of American financial systems did not occur because the federal government OVER-REGULATED them,.
The collapse of American financial systems did not occur because the federal government OVER-TAXED them.
The failure is due to: - greed, - cleaver crooks, - lax oversight, and - loose laws promulgated by a weak-kneed CONGRESS and PRESIDENT who were too chummy with K-STREET LOBBYISTS.
Wild_Weasel
· 1 year ago
What Congress and President Bush have done to promote the collapse of America's financial systems is nothing short of TREASON!
tbhull
· 1 year ago
If alive I would have cried at Kennedy's 1963, but nary a tear here if Bush were to disappear.
mf_roe
· 1 year ago
Calm yourselves, there is nothing to fear but fear. We have already lost the only thing worth fretting about our ability to govern ourselves everything else is trivial. And as in the rest of nature the crooks are about to find out what happens when you run out of fuel, the fire goes out, the engine dies, the lights blink out. There is very little left for the crooks to steal and what can they do when the have it all? The crime was vicious, but the retribution will set new limits. 95% of the population seeking revenge on 5%, yeah ugly doesn't begin to describe what awaits.
Kansaskitty
· 1 year ago
This is a travesty! If I remember right, the RTC took over the bad debts of S&Ls, put lipstick on them and resold them at a discount. However, they were the bad loans and debts of FAILED S&Ls, ones that were in bankruptcy and went out of business. This is a whole different can of worms they are proposing now - these entities HAVE NOT failed and do have some sound assets along with the toxic crap. Of course the big banks will keep the sound assets, while we the people get stuck with all that toxic paper they are hiding. What a deal! And the big banks won't go bankrupt and will continue in business just like before with a new squeaky clean balance sheet! What a swell deal!
God, I'm sick.....
tbhull
· 1 year ago
If the banks fail outright that has a cost to taxpayers for deposit insurance. What Schumer is proposing is like the AIG deal where the government gets an equity position in banks for pruchasing - unloading toxic loans on the fed.
Kansaskitty
· 1 year ago
The investment banks aren't FDIC insured though. These morons make the big bucks when they take on risks of course, but they should take the losses as well as the profits when they get reckless. And the FDIC in no way has enough money to cover the losses of the insured banks. Of course, the problem is that no one has any frigging idea how many trillions are tied up in this toxic paper or knows where it all is. Look at all the small banks, cities, other countries and pension plans etc who are invested in some of this crap. Eeeeiiiiii!
tbhull
· 1 year ago
The investment banks wrote a lot of credit default swap business on corporate bonds on foreign and domestic bank balance sheets, the same as AIG. The $85 billion AIG bailout went to prtoect or swap corporate debt covered by CDSs wrote by AIG and the taxpayers will never see the $85 billion.
We need to know the relationships between the various Central Banks around ther globe. It appears they are more interested in buttering each others' bread than helping out their repective domestic governments.
Kansaskitty
· 1 year ago
It is beginning to sound that way. What a mess. This has a long way to go to be unwound and it sounds as if there was very little prudence on any level. The fact that they want to rush some legislation through Congress is frightening as it is likely to have all kinds of unintended consequences.
The real problem is not the sub-prime mess, it's the 64Trillion Dollars that they all hold worldwide in CDS's GoldmanSacks held only about 1.3 Trillion. AIG holds about the same amount, but their insurance sector is doing fine. The problem as I see it , is if they go under, the numbers get huge on a world-wide basis.That would mean 2.6 Trillion Dollares of CDS's would come due, which are mostly worthless. Thats only for these two corporations. An RTC wont help this time because no one can put a value on any of the junk paper.
tbhull
· 1 year ago
AIG's CDS segment s not doing fine. It was the impact of Lehman's bankruptcy that triggered AIG's immediate demise due to the pending collateral calls from writing credit default swaps on Lehman debt.
RJAGIELSKI1
· 1 year ago
you are right if they would have stayed with insurance, they would have been fine.
tbhull
· 1 year ago
Do not forget the additional $730 trillion in derivatives that will have to be unwound in an "orderly" fashion, in addition to the $60 trillion or so of credit default swap out there.
RJAGIELSKI1
· 1 year ago
The one who accomplished all of this is Phil Gramm. The S&L crisis this crisis, and oh yeh the ENRON LOOPHOLE, just ask Gramms' wife.
tbhull
· 1 year ago
I am from Texas and know this little small cocked weasel quite well.
By the way Phil Grham's wife was on the board of directors of Enron when it collapsed under the weight of fraud.
I will be glad when time takes him out for good.
FrozenNorthObserver
· 1 year ago
Oh yes the "90s savings and loans" collapse. Yes yes hmmm yes I do believe that was all brought about by failure of a corrupt savings and loan called "Lincoln Savings &Loan" which had come into business on the heels of a major "deregulation" heavily pushed for from a guy from Arizona. The owner of that savings and loan that caused a 500 billion "bailout" and almost collapsed the US economy was one Charles Keating. I do believe he was a very good friend of a senator, hmmm what was his name again?? Ah yes I believe it was one "John Sidney McCain the 3rd". One of the five players in the major "Keating Five" scandal that followed the debacle. McCain and John Glenn(yes that John Glenn) got severe reprimands on the grounds that they pled that they were just really really stupid and only a little criminal. This is the second time this has happened on "his watch" and he was instrumental in both disasters by being a major player in ridding all the financial regulations he could.
tbhull
· 1 year ago
Silver State Bank's recent faliure has a McCain taint as well.
RJAGIELSKI1
· 1 year ago
Right again, Andrew McCain sat on Silver State, as well as the holding co. He left just four weeks before the fed moved in.
tbhull
· 1 year ago
Andrew was on the bank board's audit committee before leaving the Board of Directors this summer less than two moths before the FDIC shut the doors on this bank for the last time.
RJAGIELSKI1
· 1 year ago
Andrew is also the CFO of Cindy McCains' corporation and trust.
Amy_Roberts86
· 1 year ago
Arrow Financial Services briefed Congressional leaders on plans to address the "illiquid assets" on U.S. financial institutions' balance sheets, possibly including the creation of a government facility to take on financial firms' bad debts.
The proposal to create a massive facility to buy mortgage-backed securities could cost as much as a half-trillion-dollars and would involve the purchase of both private-label and government-guaranteed mortgages, according to an administration official.
All Comments
Will Dems stand up to this corporate socialism? I think we'll once again see that they too have about as much spine as a jellyfish when it comes to standing up to Wall Street.
I'm sick.
The government could care less about us but, boy we are expected to make it easy for the greedy big shots.
I am so sick and frustrated. I swear if Obama is not elected in November and we end up finding the idiots in the electorate vote in republicans again I am going to contact my family in France and leave. I refuse to stick around for the final nail in the coffin of this wacked out country and let the idiots to keep voting for republicans no matter what or how bad, let them stay and suffer for their stupidity.
Good work if you can get it, I guess. Would be hard to sleep at night for me though.
BP
Boehner sure wants Obama buried in red ink before he ever gets started. So, Boehner will sign whatever hurts the most. Senator Judd Gregg has to explain how we'll pay for it. Senator Gregg is The George Bush of The Senate.
They didn't have to die in vain?
welcome to the United States of Socialist America. The government now owns several massive corporations.
Oh.. and you know what government + corporations is? FASCISM.
Judd Gregg always has his charts to show us how The Economy is doing. He had to know more than he's telling us.
This didn't happen overnight.
OK, thought I'd ask.
everybody should default on any bank debt as well as refuse to pay taxes.
and I mean, EVERYBODY who is pissed off about this mess they got us in.
they're only going to get bailed out on our dime anyway.
True?
I remember when conservatives were all monetarists.
Guess nobody cares about Milton Friedman anymore, huh?
We have already watched and learned that not no real difference exists between repubs and dems when is comes to warrantless intrusions into all e-mail traffic and cell phone conversations without a warrant in clear fucking violation of the 4th Amendment.
We have already weatched and learned that not no real difference exists between repubs and dems when it comes to unfettered and unchecked executive power.
It is now time to again watch and learn that no difference exists between repubs and dems when it comes to doubling, at a minimum, our deficit in a single stroke of the pen and baling out ungodly worlwide wealth, fraud and greed.
e
Why should anyone have any confidence that the Congress, this administration and the Fed, the same folks that fueled this crap and knew of the financial hocus pocus of leverage and did nothing, can find a resolution? This is just furtherance of the fraud on the taxpayer forever enslaving us and our descendants for generations to come.
This is when the market works most efficiently, brutally and teaches its finest lessons. Let's learn the right way. The best answer is to let corrupt and poorly ran companies and banks fail, and we will take lessons learned, though painful for a while, and rebuild anew better, leaner and cleaner.
Let see if Obama has a pair and comes out against any further bailout using taxpayer funds. Do not count on it. McCain is a whore for $$$ so he is not worth the time of day.
It is time for one or both of the candidates to come out and say fuck NO! Chances that McCain will say no:0%. Chance that Obama will say no: 0%. We will watch and learn an outcome we already know.
One could argue they might have prevented 911 since there WAS warning, and even if not "specific" they could certainly have tightened airport security, etc.
But let that go, on top of it all, they would have treated this as a police action, as the crime it was. Instead Bush put the screws on to take it to war, to enrich his patrons. PNAC laid it all out beforehand and oilmen...it was just waiting to happen.
So, NO...they are not the same. The difference is in the climate of fear, and the illogic of scare tactics and flag pins, it would take MANY with more guts than most have, to stand up to the push for war. But don't EVER forget who drove that and made that climate that we all have to live with now. No politician with any chance of not being marginalized could demand inquiries, push for oversight, lay out for the american people what we KNEW , and call for not going to war. Some did, but the GOP controlled Congress at that time. Later, they were stuck with it.
Now we're all stuck with it.
There is most definitely a difference, and if you play the "they're all the same" card, and we get another GOP (this time McCain, we'll be at war with Spain in no time) we get more war.
That's it. We get a chance for lessened war with a democrat.
Our Congress want all the perks, the high pay, free healthcare, cusy life and the kickbacks and bribes but when it comes time to do their job and protect our interests most ran for the fucking hills. Obama did not. He voted against war measures and is now going to be President.
Every single politician who was in Congress when the unravelling of oversight and regulation occurred needs to be charged with incompetence and jailed.
Bailing out companies that are run in a piss poor manner is not the role of government. Let some people get layed off maybe next time they will speak up when they see things happen that are illegal. Like Enron where they all laughed at the bills being sent out for sky high electricity. Put them on the street and people will begin to understand that you can't cheat, lie and steal without behing held accountable. These same politicians who are opening the vaults also voted to remove the right for Americans to declare bankruptcy and right off their credit card debt, guaranteeing the same Banks and Investment companies the monies. They said Americans need to be accountable for their actions but the same does not apply to the richest segment of this country.
Americans need to quit being afraid of losing consumer comfort. It has a price, now and forever.
A better America could exist without current Wall Street and DC.
The Fed has already spent $880 billion. The results, market chaos and the promise of another multiu-trillion dollar "plan" funded by taxpayers. Give me a fucking break! How can anyone find reason to support these bullshit failures?
http://www.cnbc.com/id/26779080
In the late 1980s S&Ls failed from fraud and greed. S&Ls made bad loans and the wealthy made off quite well on ridiculously inflated real estate. When the floor collpased and failure ensued the government used taxpayer dollars to bailout the S&Ls out and taxpayers paid the bill. What happened to all thos assets of the failed S&Ls?
Well, government established Resolution Trust Corporation (RTC) took possession of billions of dollars worth of real estate, with an eye toward selling them off say taxpayers would get their oney back. Not so fast, these assetswere sold in the cheap (pennies on the dollar) to wealth and relevered.
Screw the new RTC, as it lacks creativity (Rambo II) and only perputaes the privatize profits and socilaize losses scam. These clowns are so bold and shameless they did not even redo the gam plan. Have taxpayers grown that stupid?
The short of it: this will be the greatest transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich in the history of mankind. Big business and big government (repub and dem) - they aren't enemies, they've always been on the same side.
The goal of NeoCons is to transform America into another third world country, with no middle class, and a very small very rich very powerful elite.
The collapse of American financial systems did not occur because the federal government OVER-TAXED them.
The failure is due to:
- greed,
- cleaver crooks,
- lax oversight, and
- loose laws promulgated by a weak-kneed CONGRESS and PRESIDENT who were too chummy with K-STREET LOBBYISTS.
God, I'm sick.....
We need to know the relationships between the various Central Banks around ther globe. It appears they are more interested in buttering each others' bread than helping out their repective domestic governments.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umoYaS49Dnw
By the way Phil Grham's wife was on the board of directors of Enron when it collapsed under the weight of fraud.
I will be glad when time takes him out for good.
McCain and John Glenn(yes that John Glenn) got severe reprimands on the grounds that they pled that they were just really really stupid and only a little criminal. This is the second time this has happened on "his watch" and he was instrumental in both disasters by being a major player in ridding all the financial regulations he could.
The proposal to create a massive facility to buy mortgage-backed securities could cost as much as a half-trillion-dollars and would involve the purchase of both private-label and government-guaranteed mortgages, according to an administration official.
Source: MRS Associates