DISQUS

AMERICAblog: Rachel Maddow: Hillary is taking this to the convention

  • tas · 1 year ago
    Time to start e-mailing superdelegates and Democratic leaders on this. Here is Nancy Pelosi's contact link for Speaker of the House: http://speaker.house.gov/contact/comment_email

    Remember, be polite. But it is ok to let her know what it would be like to work with President McCain.
  • blackwolf · 1 year ago
    Damned weak super delegates! F*ck everyone of them who hasn't committed.
  • Milli · 1 year ago
    Rachel, will your marry me????
  • Mollie · 1 year ago
    I'm beginning to wonder about Rachel. She keeps bringing this up about Hillary taking it to the convention, like she is hoping it will happen. Something is just strange with her. Could she be a Hillary supporter? It doesn't seem like others keep up that drum beat.
  • tlsintx · 1 year ago
    read the very end of Rachel's article from HuffPost...she declares her neutrality...i think she's just worried about a fiasco at the convention that ultimately helps the GOPers.
  • interlude · 1 year ago
    i have always enjoyed Rachel, and found much of her analysis interesting, if occasionally a bit overboard. however, i have found Rachel rather curious lately, too. i don't know if she is saying what she is saying as a way of risking and potentially upping her rep, or if she is freaking, or if she has some agenda.
    i don't doubt that Hillary will take it to the convention, Rachels concern is for the election, mine is for the party. i think Obama can win regardless if he campaigns aggressively.

    what it seems to me is really going on is a struggle for control of the party, between Clinton Establishment DLC peeps and new blood (ala Obama). and what it comes down to is the Clinton Tag team has decided to make it a death match.
  • elRey · 1 year ago
    aww quit your hyperventilating you haters, she's be gone by June 3rd.

    10+ very good reasons why Obama should pick Hillary as Veep (from salon)

    I have been as outraged at the behavior of the Clinton campaign as anyone and for quite some time. But even I have to acknowledge that the best choice Obama could make for Veep is Hillary, and it's not close. Here are my 10+ reasons why-

    1) Republicans have spent the last few months glorying in the split amongst Democrats, and very much talking up Hillary Clinton. When they see all that division go up in vapor instantaneously when Hillary's name is announced, and their own would-be attacks on her blunted by their own prior praise, it will be demoralizing (not to mention rudely bring home the fact that their party is the one divided).

    2) The Republicans want this campaign to be about Obama's ethnic/oriental/foreignness. It is really their only hope of winning. Hillary's high profile- and no other VP candidate outside of Gore (who's NA) would match it- has the effect of deflecting this charge by taking a large part of the burden for the spotlight (and further weakness the effect of Obama's unsavory associations on the electorate). It brings familiarity where there the lack of it is more weakness than strength. How many people out there know who Strickland is?

    3) Hillary has spent months and months criticizing Obama in very stark terms, crossing every Rubicon she could find about Wright, Ayers, etc.. This gives her- and I'm aware of the irony of this- much credibility when it comes to Obama. If she can embrace his candidacy its going to give doubtful Americans every reason to do so also.

    4) It would heal the party's severe disunity, and especially given how close the primary was- it couldn't have been any closer really. And while I loathe the arguments that Obama hasn't won this fair and square- he unquestionably has- there's no doubt that if any runner up has earned the right to be on a ticket in history, it is Hillary.

    5) Relatedly, it would boost the fund raising capacity of the combined ticket more than any other VP pick would

    6) Hillary would instantaneously give Obama huge credibility amongst Jewish voters he needs to shore up PA and to make McCain at least play defense in Florida. Polling shows she also helps him in Ohio which he may not even need the way this is going.

    7) Hillary would also give Obama a significant boost in credibility with the Latino community he very much needs to shore up New Mexico and make him stronger in Nevada

    8) Hillary is undoubtedly tough, and not shy of attacks, which is the primary role for a VP in a campaign (whereas Wes Clark and Jim Webb are not cut out for this in the least). She'd have little trouble ripping into McCain where Obama doesn't seem in the least bit comfortable doing it.

    9) Relatedly, one of the problems of attacking McCain is that you leave yourself open to patriotism charges, especially if the one doing the attacking hasn't served in the military. This charge would be largely blunted simply because Hillary is a woman and the culture does not evaluate women in the same way (it would likewise not be a problem for Webb or Clark, but, as stated, they're not remotely at home on the attack).

    10) Hillary would clean the clocks of Romney or Crist or any other Republican stooge McCain goes with in the VP debates (while Obama beats up on McCain in the town halls). This is the bon mot.

    +) It would bring Maureen Dowd's trite little world crashing down around her.

    In summary, I think it's a clear winner from an electoral perspective. I don't' see how they don't win in November combined. I furthermore think it's a winner for the country once they're in office.

    There are a few not inconsequential negatives, including their both (and especially Hillary) having to confront the charges they at each other during the primary, (e.g. they lose the ability to attack McCain on the gas tax, etc.), Hillary's potential Bill/Burkle/papers problems, etc., but I don't think those are very decisive, and I don't buy the argument that a women and black man ticket with the mandate to overturn Bush policies across the board does not constitute the Change ticket. The only real negative worth fearing is if somehow the mutual antipathy toward each other that was born and grew up during this campaign was not papered over. In that case though, they will have no one to blame but themselves.
  • interlude · 1 year ago
    and you trust her to play 2nd fiddle to Obama for 8 years???
    roflmao
  • brilliantatbreakfast · 1 year ago
    There's something Shakespearean about the image of a young man, in Shakespeare it would be a young king, with a high level courtier plotting against him -- a courtier whose family once held the crown and no longer does. Sounds like a recipe for watching one's back.
  • Dontice · 1 year ago
    I'm so sick of the Clintons and their immoral conduct. Hillary and her supporters are trying to destroy the Democratic Party. I don't know a single Obama supporter who would ever vote for this witch. These corrupt slime need to leave the Democratic Party. The Clinton's racist negative ads and attempts to steal the nomination are beyond disgusting. How can Hillary supporters embrace such criminality and deceit? Would a HIllbot please answer that question.
  • scooter in brooklyn · 1 year ago
    there's time for panic on june 5. let montana, south dakota and puerto rico have their elections. june 4 should see a flood of supers for obama making florida and michigan moot. obama is cool, calm and brilliant. far too smart to put shrillary on the ticket.

    rachel would be a great replacement for david gregory.
  • naschkatzehussein · 1 year ago
    I agree with you and think Rachel is being a little hysterical. We white Obama supporters (yes, Virginia, there are white Obama supporters) need to take a page from our black constituency and Senator Obama himself. They are reacting to all this shit from the Clintons with dignity and restraint in the tradition of MLK.
  • tlsintx · 1 year ago
    Rachel doesn't do hysterical.
    she is one cool woman.
  • interlude · 1 year ago
    the problem ,scooter, is that there was going to be of "flood" of superDs after Oregon, and before that, and before that...i dont think f these folks as very "SUPER" at this pint.
  • Milli · 1 year ago
    Dem voters need to come out in droves SOON and tell her directly to sit down, shut up, and fall in line. This is insane.
  • Jim Olson · 1 year ago
    You mean other than the racist redneck voters...
  • tbhull · 1 year ago
    The longer this goes on without any dem leaders bringing this to an end the more I really believe only one party with two faces exists. As stated in the thread below, Obama is a super candidate that has won and Hillary needs to go. But until the dem party, currently so lacking in leadership puts an end to this bs, Clinton can go on at her own and the party's peril. The dem power structure looks more and more every day to be really republican.
  • naschkatzehussein · 1 year ago
    But if she fails to move the goal posts on May 31 and Obama becomes the de facto nominee, does she have any say whatever in the settlement of MI and FL? What she intends to do is fight on the beaches of Normandy for every last superdelegate vote until August. But I think she is pissing them off: Obama takes 5 today including 1 away from her. I think the superdelegates will feed Obama just enough votes to let the final 3 primaries put him over the top, and then the superdelegates will come out in droves for Obama including those who switch from Clinton. Then, even though they don't officially cast their votes until the convention, Clinton will know that she cannot take anywhere near enough superdelegates from Obama in the end.
  • interlude · 1 year ago
    it is the SUPERDELEGATES!!!

    the superdelegtes need to grow spines, speak up, and send her back to NY, Arkansas, Illinois, Pennsylvania, West Virginia, or wherever the hell she is from this week.
  • nuneutralobserver2008 · 1 year ago
    "I think if the Clinton campaign won 100% of what they wanted on the Florida and Michigan dispute, Obama could still clinch the nomination -- even according to the most pro-Clinton math -- if 90 of the remaining 210-or-so undeclared superdelegates declared for Obama.

    If they so declared before May 31st, the Rules and Bylaws committee would have no reason to take up the Florida and Michigan dispute because it would be a moot point -- Obama's camp could concede every Clinton demand on the subject and still win the nomination"

    ***

    I think there is some misunderstanding about superdelegates. When superdelegates "endorse" a candidate, it is just that -- an endorsement. It is not an official vote. It only becomes an official vote when the superdelegates vote at the convention. That's why Clinton won't drop out. There is NO OFFICIAL COUNT PRIOR TO THE CONVENTION THAT WILL MAKE OBAMA THE WINNER. It mathematically can not happen.

    So the scenario HAS to play out like this:

    Sometime before, or at the convention, the MI/FL situation has to be settled. That determines the number of delegates the Obama needs. Let's call that the magic number.

    Then, a first vote will occur at the convention. If the total number of pledged delegates for Obama, plus the actual convention votes of the superdelegates, EXCEEDS the magic number, then Obama wins.

    However, if enough superdelegates decide to abstain, then a second vote is taken. At that point, and for all subsequent votes, Obama's pledged delegates are NO LONGER PLEDGED TO OBAMA. On the second vote and all subsequent votes, all delegates ("pledged" or "super") are free to vote for any candidate.
  • jr · 1 year ago
    swamp thing Hillary's republican proxyism knows no bounds