AMERICAblog: Rick Warren explicitly bans "unrepentant" gays from membership in his church
KarenMrsLloydRichards
· 11 months ago
Ya see, Rick loves the gays when he can pity them, all skinny and wracked with the "AIDS virus", their big eyes like those of abandoned puppies at the local shelter. Empowered, self-actualized, partnered gays: not so much.
gumbygirl
· 11 months ago
Off topic, but Blagojovich was bug-eyed crazy on national TV seconds ago!
Indigo
· 11 months ago
Wouldn't he be great in a crazy-guy movie with Mark Wallenberg?
Gary SF
· 11 months ago
Oh, now I get it: Hate the sin, Hate the sinner.
Indigo
· 11 months ago
Not any more. It's "Hate the sinner, hide the sin."
Diogenes
· 11 months ago
Don't blame Rick Warren for this. Yes, he's a hater and an all-around horse's ass, but Obama is the one who's giving him an international spotlight.
Barack is looking like Dubya in his unwillingness to admit a mistake. Either that or he doesn't think it's a mistake, which is even worse.
Al
· 11 months ago
DING. DING. DING.
Dave of the Jungle
· 11 months ago
You should change, immediately. Would you like some help?
You don't want to burn in hell for eternity, do you?
Come and feel the conditional "love" we have for you.
KarenMrsLloydRichards
· 11 months ago
The Rick Warren World View:
Closeted, psychically damaged gays with wives and kids: good. They can be recruited for Warren's version of Jesus. And they can drop $$$ in the plate.
Liberated, psychically integrated gays with partners: bad.
Liberated, psychically integrated gays with partners and kids: very bad. No $$$ there.
Silverlakejim
· 11 months ago
I can't imagine Obama inviting a pastor who does not allow African-Americans membership in his congregation, or any sort of organization that does not allow membership to Jewish Americans.
We it comes to the GLBT community we are still riding at the back of the Obama bus.
Diogenes
· 11 months ago
Of course you are exactly correct. We won't be hearing from Trent Lott at the inauguration.
On a side note, it's good to see the T back in place with the GLB. Let's not be so quick to throw our fellow warriors under the bus like so many of us were ready to do, just a few months ago. Imagine how they felt when the Gs Ls and Bs turned their backs on them in order to improve their own chances at equality.
Chrissy
· 11 months ago
All I can say is wow.
The website pretty much says that any study done about gays is wrong. And even if they were right, they are still wrong.
Chrissy
· 11 months ago
I wondered what Rick Warren will do to the non-donut eating gays. I guess we found out -- kick them out of his church.
Greensburg
· 11 months ago
Keep at it John. Thank you from the bottom of my gay heart.
PatogTX
· 11 months ago
"...would not be accepted at a member at Saddleback"
Perhaps they meant "..AS a member..."? Nothing makes me more nuts than a bigot who doesn't proof read.
SCLiberal
· 11 months ago
LOL, that made my day.
curlytoes79
· 11 months ago
They also won't accept anyone who's currently living with a romantic partner but unmarried.
But apparently they will accept divorcees, even though Jesus explicitly says that "anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery.'" Matthew 19:3-9 This is probably because, if they barred all divorcees from membership, 3/4 of their pews would be empty and so would their coffers.
Rob Mule
· 11 months ago
"Unrepentant" about what being gay or being needy enough to join Rick's little money maker, er, family money maker?
Here's a question I'd like to see someone raise on TV: If John McCain wanted to join the Saddleback church, would Warren force him to divorce Cindy and re-marry his first wife before he'd allow him to become a member? Because Jesus said if you divorce and re-marry you're committing adultery. Does Saddleback church allow unrepentent heterosexual adulterers? EDIT: Oops, somebody already raised this issue...
Mark in Florida
· 11 months ago
CALL and WRITE the Obama transition team to demand that President-elect Obama to say no to anti-gay Rick Warren from delivering the invocation at Obama's inauguration.
WHAT YOU CAN DO:
1. CALL/EMAIL Emmett Belivau, Executive Director/CEO of the Inaugural Committee:
Barack Obama's victory over fear and hate was a historic event, about which we are tremendously proud.
Rick Warren is on the wrong side of history. Elevating him to the privilege of speaking at the Inauguration is wrong.
We urge you to convey to the President-Elect that he, and we as a nation, are ill-served by this decision.
Sincerely,
Mark in Florida
· 11 months ago
Well said! :-)
moreleesafer
· 11 months ago
i love it. I was trying to find the right words. I may jsut borrow a few of yours.
KarenMrsLloydRichards
· 11 months ago
Permission granted!
Greensburg
· 11 months ago
Do you think any of this is making its way to Obama or is he insulated in his "bubble of brilliance"? Is his arrogance so great and his ideals so lofty that he doesnt see any of this? What if the word gay was switched with black or jew? Would he then understand?
James
· 11 months ago
That's mighty un-Xtian of the Bareback Church.
johnosahon
· 11 months ago
as a gay-black man this is my 2 cents into this crazy.
firstly, let me answer the question that is always used here and everywhere, "will obama do this if it was the black communityy and invite a racist?"
ANSWER: if the public view was at least 50/50 on this issue , probably YES, YES , YES. (em Obama would not be president anyways with views on the black community being that way, so maybe you would be having hillary- hell hillary would have no chance either - so probably you would be asking mccain)
if you recall, in the past with interacial marriage, black rights, em, half of the people in congress were KKK members or proud friends of one, the other half were "REACHING ACCROSS" to them.
so in conclusion, this all depends on the society we live in, the american society is 50/50 on this issue (gay marriage), so this is what happens. in canada where i live in, our society has moved on, that is the ONLY reason why gay marriage is a non-issue here and a HOT MESS in the U.S.A.
that's all folks.
John Aravosis
· 11 months ago
I think you're right. That's the dilemma that minorities face. They are not just a minority in terms of numbers, they're a minority in terms of popular support, at least for a very long time. But Obama claims to know better, claims to understand that homophobia is just as wrong as bigotry against other groups. That's why, for him, this is troubling I think. But your point is well made.
johnosahon
· 11 months ago
i get what you are trying to say, but i do believe Obama is trying show that he can work with everybody. maybe it is foolish, stupid or genious, i will take his word on it.
i would start complaining if he starts making homophobic policies, till then i will SHUT UP, but i do understand where you are coming from.
johnosahon
· 11 months ago
lastly, i have never in my life heard an elected president talking about gay and lesbians, saying how he has always been a supporter of gays and lesbians. the last time a president put us in sentence was when he was talking about changing the constituition or when he making excuses on why he passed DADT. just saying.
Steve_in_CNJ
· 11 months ago
as far is know, people like LBJ who were reaching out to racists in the turbulent 60s were not saying their racism was a moral point of view. at worst, they accepted segregation as a legitimate position, but not the rabid racism and negro-bashing. also i think you can check into LBJ's 1965 inauguration and you won't find any prominent racists praying him into office. according to some arguments, he would have every right to do so since no presidents before him (except for JFK) had been a "fierce" supporter of african-american equality.
KarenMrsLloydRichards
· 11 months ago
Hmm kay, Obama says he's "FIERCE" about defending equality for gays and lesbians. Talk is cheap. Let's see him walk the talk. He's got 48 months to learn.
Al
· 11 months ago
AGAIN, THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH GAY MARRIAGE!!!
Why are people so thick to get this through their heads?
Greensburg
· 11 months ago
Thank you Mark in Florida. You saved me alot of research time. I will hound all of them continuously.
usagi
· 11 months ago
Cool! Does that mean we can file a discrimination lawsuit or maybe charge him with a hate-crime? No? But he said during the Prop 8 campaign... Oh, darn, that's right--he lied.
Bush Bites
· 11 months ago
Obama's analogy--comparing Warren being invited to the inauguration to Obama being invited to Saddleback--is false too.
Saddleback was specifically for Warren's followers and on Warren's property, the inaguration is for the entire country and on public lands.
Totally different thing.
Indigo
· 11 months ago
Okay, now you lost me, John. Why would I want to join that church?
Steve_in_CNJ
· 11 months ago
LOL!
Steve
· 11 months ago
John, I'm so glad you are being a hard ass about this. People want to brush all this aside as insignificant, but as a gay man, this kind of stuff IS significant to me. I'm really upset with Obama's choice here. I am a hardcore Obama supporter, but this has truly discouraged me.
Why is it STILL ok to bash gays and get away with it!?
JustAGuy
· 11 months ago
Guest blogger Susie Bright over at BoingBoing has a prescient observation:
Warren has all the earmarks we saw with Ted Haggard, Larry Craig, Bob Allen, David "DiaperPants" Vitter, et al. It's a bad rerun.
If this dude isn't found in a bathroom with a wide stance and a hooker in the next year, someone's not doing their job. Paging Jeff Gannon!
I have to say, I do get a similar vibe from Warren. Anyone else?
-S
samiinh
· 11 months ago
Yes, me too. I am waiting excitedly for that day.
Milli
· 11 months ago
I went through my mp3 player last night getting it ready for a long and tedious trip home for Christmas. If you're looking for a musical outlet for your frustrations over the current Warren controversy, I rediscovered two songs well worth downloading......."Let it Ring" and "Philosophy of Loss". The first by Amy Ray of the Indigo Girls, the second by Emily Saliers also of the Indigo Girls. (Philosophy of Loss is a hidden track attached to another song "Faye Tucker". They're a package deal.). If you find yourself tempted to give in and go along with Obama's decision to put Warren on a pedestal, these will remind you why you need to keep fighting him on this.
Al
· 11 months ago
Why aren't you posting all this on Huffington Post, where the media will actually see it?
barts
· 11 months ago
Is there a cure for poor spelling? Hummm?
FunMe
· 11 months ago
OH MY GOSH ... he really is worse than I thought!
He's banning gays, oh wait those with the "homosexual lifestyle" (typical words of a HOMOPHOBE).
Is that what Jesus would do? I don't think so!
W. Todd Magowan
· 11 months ago
This is a perfect example of why Americablog.com is one of the best web-resources today; the Saddleback church, however, is a perfect example of homophobia. This is a cardboard cut out of Rick Warren shaking hands with Jesus to PLAINLY DISCRIMINATE against Out LGBTQ people. Can anyone truly argue that this creed should be defended without playing devil's advocate? We (speaking as a gay American) put up with enough "Wait for your turn, right now the bigger problems come first" bullshit. To have this guy speak at the Inauguration means I'm doubling my efforts travel to Washington to hold a sign for my man Obama to see. I donated money that could've gone to rent to get him elected, I wore my Obama Pride sticker proudly, and now I feel ashamed to defend my president-elect in the midst of my own people.
Where's Drudge, NBC, CNN, or FOX to actually pick up something that matters to the GLBTQ community? Covering Blagojevich saying AGAIN that he's innocent and won't back down. Ploy to be tougher on Obama? Oh wait, polls show that voters aren't and won't tie Obama to Blago.
The hypocrisy is startling and, as the bumper stickers exclaim:
IF YOU'RE NOT OUTRAGED, YOU HAVEN'T BEEN PAYING ATTENTION!
Bryan Blumberg
· 11 months ago
What is particularly pernicious about the Saddleback website is that homosexual are the ONLY type of people who have been singled out for denial of membership.
KerrynowCampau
· 11 months ago
If you live "in sin" you can't become a member either
But, hey, they won't stop you from attending and I bet when they pass the plate around they will take your money.
The Tim Channel
· 11 months ago
What about the Godless shellfish eaters? Why is their sinful, yet delicious blaspheme free from constant condemnations? Does it have any relation to the corpulence of the average fundamentalist preacher? Are the less corpulent clergy more prone to condemn the crab eaters and gluttons than their more portly (dipped in clarified butter) counterparts? Inquiring minds want to know.
At the restaurant in Hell the favored dish of deceased evangelicals is levitical linguini, garnished with shellfish sauteed in saintly sauce. The Devil is hand preparing a big batch, eagerly awaiting the arrival of Mr. Warren. They'll have a discussion on biblical FOCUS right before the dark avenger flings Warren's flabby crab eating soul into the hellfire of eternal damnation.
The rotisserie the Devil uses for roasting pork (a favorite of the sinning Jews) drips grease on the burning bodies of the godless crab eaters. The resulting smoke and flame adds a slightly nutty and mysterious flavor to the pork that heightens it's appeal. No two smoked pigs ever quite taste the same. They tend to vary from person to person. It's part of the appeal of the dish.
Enjoy.
FunMe
· 11 months ago
I have an idea: if your really "must" see Warren on the inaugaration day, turn your back towards him and throw WATER and DONUTS up in the air! (We don't want you arrested throwing them at him. But wait, we could just leave it at the stage?).
Gridlock
· 11 months ago
but.. but why isn't Warren's church INCLUSIVE.. isn't that what this is all about? We have to be INCLUSIVE of "different viewpoints"... unless you're fat f#ck Warren and his Christofascist backup singers. Then you're allowed to be as exclusionary as you want, and the President Elect will pat you on the back for it!
So, the rest of us have to accept Fat F#ck Warren and his bigoted shit, but he can turn us away when it suits him.
I see how it is, Obama.
Screw you.
nogo postal
· 11 months ago
So John, your response to someone who bans...is to...ban them? Bush did not invent "either your with us or against us."
Maybe Obama's philosophy and actions won't work. But the last 30 years sure haven't
I am simply tired of anyone banning anyone.
Tell ya what John and others...go to DC..and on the 20th commit an act of civil disobedience...get arrested.. have the local government jail you for your beliefs. Seriously John...in the 8 years of Bush. How many times have you placed yourself in a position of arrest to physically assert your beliefs? Maybe you missed out on the Bush years.. I await your demonstration of commitment on the first day of the Obama years... One my my seven since 2003 http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_4099557 (and yeah that's my pic..and yeah I fasted during my incarceration)
You all are pissed off...cool If this is not worth arrest for you...what is?
tbl92666
· 11 months ago
So, once again; do racists get a seat at the table? Anti-semites? Misogynists?
I'm sick of our so-called progressive friends telling us that our struggle is somehow inferior to, well; everyone else's.
The underlying belief of the "inclusive" Obama apologists is the same as Warren's (which is probably why you are o.k. with this choice), and that is: homosexuality is a choice and therefore not really the same as being a woman or being black or being...whatever. You can dress it up any way you like, but that is what you and Obama are saying loud and clear with this choice and with your apologies.
And as for the gays who are apologizing for Obama's choice, I just can't even to begin to fathom what is going on in your heads. What is the gay equivalent of an 'Uncle Tom'. Log Cabin?
And to the op: Wow. You've been to jail a few times for your so-called beliefs: its all window dressing, as your words betray the fact that you don't even believe your own b.s.
scottinsf
· 11 months ago
Hear hear!
The bigots and apologists apparently thought teh gays would just continue sitting down and shutting up. Well, those days are fucking over. I'm going to call out bigotry when I see it and if that makes some so-called liberals uncomfortable in their own skin so be it.
Lot's of people are now trying to say that civil rights equality is a "fringe" or "far left" idea. Fine. This radical is going to get in their face every step of way then. Tough shit if people don't like it.
TampaZeke
· 11 months ago
Jesus Christ, what self respecting gay person would "attend" a church that had such a message on their "church family" website?
KerrynowCampau
· 11 months ago
For that matter what self respecting anybody.....
Ben Dover
· 11 months ago
Someone down thread (other thread?) posted that portions of Barry the Pandering Politician's website it now closed for further comment. Barry can't take the heat of his horribly mismanaged position, so he closes off discussion? Way to go Barry! Stop all the dissent so that you don't have to answer. There is nothing that Barry can say or do to gloss over the overt hatred that Warren and his ATM, I mean "church", demonstrates on its website. Maybe Barry can come spew more of the same bullshit he spewed at his nomination in Denver. We'd all believe that right about now, wouldn't we?
nogo postal
· 11 months ago
your use of the word"Barry" in poker is called a tell...jist sayin'
Ben Dover
· 11 months ago
I had/have no idea about the word "Barry" being used in poker. I gotta get out more often I guess.
nogo postal
· 11 months ago
In poker a tell is some action a person does that reveals their true intention. Calling our next President Barry reveals your intention..and yes you do need to get out more.
Steve_in_CNJ
· 11 months ago
it would be like calling the pope Ratzy. there, i've revealed my intentions!
widestanceromancer
· 11 months ago
No doubt my sin-cash is still welcome in the collection plate of the hateful.
justadood
· 11 months ago
people really need to dig into this poser's past, and find his "Jim Bakker" moment. Warren's pretty much an updated, upgraded Jim Bakker or Jimmy Swaggart.....it should be only a matter of time and patience to find his dirty little secret.
*ALL* TV preachers have one....
kingbuzzo
· 11 months ago
Personally, I think it says a lot to treat someone with respect even if they deny you the same respect.
Gridlock
· 11 months ago
Yeah, it says "kick me in the crotch harder, I don't mind"
kingbuzzo
· 11 months ago
And your belligerent posing and posturing says that you are a latent heterosexual with violent tendencies caused by a conflicted relationship with your authoritarian father.
Gridlock
· 11 months ago
I'll tell that to my boyfriend, right after I send this in an e-mail to the father I didn't have.
kingbuzzo
· 11 months ago
I hope you know that I am just kidding around.... you know, the history of psychoanalytic views of gender through the lens of pathology....
But seriously, fighting never got me anything. Talking sense, building consensus, that's where it's at. Only fight when you are in mortal peril.
Prop 8 is the sound of homophobia on its deathbed.
usagi
· 11 months ago
No, pick the correct moment to fight before you get into mortal peril and you never get to the moment when you have your life on the line. All sides benefit from striking early while the stakes are lower as someone always has to lose a kill or be killed fight.
Steve_in_CNJ
· 11 months ago
well that wouldn't apply to Obama, unless you are saying he is gay.
kingbuzzo
· 11 months ago
No. I think that people should stop trying to "ban" Warren, and instead focus on a more disciplined critique of Warren's views. I live in a red area of the US, and people around here are paranoid of gays. They think queer folks are part of a conspiracy. They are to right wing Americans, what the Jews were in the 1950s.
I think any intelligent activism has to be aware of the form of people's prejudices. Only flex your muscles when strategically necessary, but always balance it with positive cultural work (philanthropy, PR, and dialogue).
I think Harvey Milk is a good example of the kind of leadership that is lacking right now. MLK is also another good example.
Defiant
· 11 months ago
This is the perfect time to reorganize the so-called Gay Agenda. If we are to enact change, to force the cringing Democrats to stand up for us, they must fear us. To that end, the HRC, our biggest lobby group, needs to go for broke spending its cash on the primaries. When Dems won't stand up for us, we should finance a primary challenger that will. By using the outrage and hurt caused by Prop 8 and now the inauguration, we can reshape the movement into something more cogent, powerful, and dare I say it? Fierce.
Mark in Florida
· 11 months ago
Well said. You are absolutely correct. Unfortunately the HRC are too politically correct and tend to take the path of least resistance. I for one am sick of it. Screw these right wing biggots.
nogo postal
· 11 months ago
So you will go to DC ...or your home town and commit civil disobedience that will result in arrest in protest? cool! (of course it will effect your resume.)
kingbuzzo
· 11 months ago
Fierce? Why? Remember what happened in post-MLK America? White flight? Renewed segregation? A crackdown on "militant" blacks through COINTELPRO? Do you think flexing muscles is going to make things easier?
It's just going to justify segregation to an easily frightened public.
KarenMrsLloydRichards
· 11 months ago
Alas, the Gay Agenda has been adversely affected by the Recession. Shopping for clothing and hair products, bar-hopping, and blowing "straight" men in airport rest rooms are all pre-Recession successes. We may actually have to get political now.
/snark/
benb
· 11 months ago
'....someone unwilling to repent of their homosexual lifestyle would not be accepted..."
Hmmmm. Sounds like more than a few at Saddleback have a guilty conscience.
kingbuzzo
· 11 months ago
Maybe he's going to use the occasion to come out.
Jay
· 11 months ago
I wouldn't WANT to join his stinking church!
Besides, I'm Jewish.
wearing out my F key
· 11 months ago
"We get lectures about civility and the need to welcome everyone, even those we disagree with"....
except on protecting the envioroment. and on providing education for the disadvantaged. and literacy projects. and helping the poor. and fighting aids. and promoting reconciliation.
and it's not "our inauguration".
TampaZeke
· 11 months ago
IT MOST CERTAINLY IS OUR INAUGURATION. The president elect could be sworn in in a private ceremony. The WHOLE purpose of the inauguration is for THE PEOPLE to be witnesses to his swearing in. The day is for AMERICA, Obama just gets the privilege of headlining the event.
I'll give you one thing Mr. F key. You are consistently one of the most ignorant,(and arrogantly so) posters that trolls this site. Do you come here to vent only because none of your favorite conservative websites HAVE comment sections?
jimkhm
· 11 months ago
Oh would it be asking too much for a holiday gift to have Rick Warren's male prostitute show up? Am I asking for too much?
Anti-Rick
· 11 months ago
I just spontaneously unsuscribed from BarakObama.Com And stated why in two paragraphs. Maybe every GLBT person who is a suscriber should do the same
eclare
· 11 months ago
I did too. You don't have to be GLBT to despise bigotry.
nogo postal
· 11 months ago
Do you plan to move off the block where you live if bigots or war mongers live on the same block? On 1/20 ...Obama will be your President...ya want to make a point? Quit your job...spend every day picketing the White House.. Make your physical resistance...visible. Ya gotta a little more than unsubscribe...although that is a start...
JD
· 11 months ago
Same here, I'm a straight black dude (and donor) and this whole thing sucks. Maybe Hopey will change his mind before the 20th
TampaZeke
· 11 months ago
John, I was outraged when I heard about the choice of Warren to give the invocation at Obama's inauguration. I became even more upset the more information I was given, primarily from this site, but also from others. I have to admit that I, very uncharacteristically, thought you went off the rails with the Syria story. It really seemed like a vacuous and desperate attempt to pull another minority into the fight. It really seemed a bit Bill O’Reilly/Michelle Malkin-like.
However, you have completely redeemed yourself in my eyes with this latest revelation. This is ABSOLUTELY and completely relevant to this issue and the outrage that it has generated. I can't imagine a more perfect example of how absurd it is to "reach out" and give a place of honor at this year’s inauguration (which CONTRARY to many people's assertion is THE PEOPLE'S event, NOT the president's alone). How can he possibly justify adding this man to the lineup, in a place of honor, at an event that is supposed to bring EVERYONE together when this man SPECIFICALLY and UNIQUELY denies membership to his church to ONLY ONE group of "sinners" and proudly says so on his church’s "saddlebackFAMILY' website. He says nothing about denying membership to ANY other people or groups of people based on their “sin”. They actually say on their FAMILY page that unrepentant gays are not welcome in their family.
If we knew NOTHING more about this man, this revelation alone should disqualify him from having this place of honor on this day of celebrating and honoring inclusion AND those who INCLUDE.
Pete
· 11 months ago
That website statement puts my feelings about the Rick Warren debacle into beyond horrified, if such a thing is possible.
It would be no different if Obama had an as inauguration speaker a person who owned a country club that disallowed blacks.
This is OUTRAGEOUS.
Kenster999
· 11 months ago
Actually, the following paragraph on their web site says that straight couples living together before marriage are also unwelcome to become members. Interestingly, though, there's another section on that same page that talks about how divorce is generally not allowed, but there's no prohibition from becoming members.
It's a tough line, because I fully support their right to interpret the Bible as they believe to be true, and I'm not trying to force their church to do anything that goes against their beliefs. But it still feels like a kick in the gut, especially so soon after the passage of Prop 8. And I feel so bad for those kids already born who are gay but don't know it yet or haven't accepted it yet. That church is so large there have got to be a ton of already-gay kids who are growing up in an environment that judges them to be sick and sinners just because of who God made them.
The Tim Channel
· 11 months ago
yup.
Enjoy.
NGLTF
· 11 months ago
Warren quoted Leviticus to argue that gays are an evil people. Yet he very carefully left out the complete passage. The next sentence after the part his quoted calls for THE DEATH PENALTY for gays. Where is the goddamn media? Why isn't anyone asking Warren why he is quoting Leviticus when it specifically calls for gays to be EXECUTED!!!
derekcbart
· 11 months ago
I just canceled my monthly contributions to the DNC, DSCC, and the DCCC and let them know that it was because of Rick Warren doing the inauguration invocation.
Boycottutah
· 11 months ago
Obama is not stupid. He knew exactly what message he would be sending the LBGT Community. Obama is telling us that we are less than human, that we deserve fewer rights than humans. He ignores the Constitution (equal protection) and instead thumps the Bible telling us that our relationships do not deserve the rights and protections of marriage because "God is in the mix".
We have been duped and screwed by Obama. I hope the Obama cultists will finally wake up from the Kool-Aid buzz!
Pierre1234
· 11 months ago
I just unsubscribed from Obama's email list listing Rick Warren as the reason. I am convinced that Warren's inaugural appearance will be canceled if only 100,000 or so Obama supporters / small donors cancel their Obama emails. After a few days, once Warren is out, you can resubcribe from barackobama.com...
CuriousMWM
· 11 months ago
Wow, that screen shot pretty much sums it up! What Bible are these people reading? Summarily excluded over your sex life? Jesus's words exist only a few chapters of Matthew and John and those versus contain nothing about the sex life. MOst of what Jesus actually said is about the evils of money, something completey and conveniently ignored by these so-called "Christians." How do you respond to Matthew:6:24, Pastor Warren? Warren and his flock are just scared little humans and its very disappointing that Obama so obviously bright and enlightened would feel the need to pander to his ilk. Looks to me like "the gay" was used for votes and grassroots same as the end-timers were used by the other party in '04.
red_dwarf
· 11 months ago
You know curious what really gets me about Warren is that he's such an asshole. Obama not only put a homophobe front and center "to legitimize" he rubbed salt in the wound by choosing an asshole on top of it.
Obama screwed up. What makes all of this dissapointing, as I pointed out to will from NYC above - is that he comes back with this bullshit response about "being inclusive". Homophobia is NEVER acceptable, period. Obama knows that. But Obama is looking to 2012. Personally, after what he just did, I can't stand to look at the man any longer. I have lost ALL respect for him. Anyone who embraces bigotry and homophobia are losers in my world, spineless cowards. Nothing more, nothing less.
Jack
· 11 months ago
This will not be a popular post...I think the gays (I'm one of you) should calm down about this...Obama clearly has a game plan and I am anxious to see how it plays out...I wasn't happy about the way Lieberman was handled either, but this is a new administration...people with opposing views aren't destroyed, or shunned...they are invited to sit and have a conversation...exposure helps us...Obama knows he won't get our vote next time if he takes this hard turn right...by the way, the Saddleback website won't allow membership for unrepentant homosexuals, but it does say we are welcome...as far as that goes, do you really want to go anyway?
The Tim Channel
· 11 months ago
Lieberman was worse for ALL dems and not just the subset 'homosexual'. Thanks for reminding me. I'm trying to give Obie a little slack. Hope it isn't totally misplaced.
The biggest issue facing those who took the time to 'blog in'? on some poll he did last week was drug legalization. THE BIGGEST ISSUE. THE ONE MOST PRESSING TO MOST PEOPLE.
He's an honest doper who has hit the big time. Let's see how he deals with the rest of us. That will be REALLY telling.
Gosh, why would anyone find that offensive in any way, shape, or form?
lynn47
· 11 months ago
Maybe Obama asked Warren to be part of the inaguration so we could all learn what kind of person Warren really is,,,,uuhhh, maybe not, but it does seem to be working out that way. Vettting is a Bitch!!!
Obama should have known better. This part is almost as bad as Warren himself.
Ben Dover
· 11 months ago
Has St. Rick of Saddleback ATM ever released a financial statement. One that shows his "salary" (for being an agent of gawd), cars, homes, planes, flights, credit cards, "massage therapists" and all the other goods and services that go with mega-"church" status? If not, I would seriously wonder what (and how much) he has to hide.
willnyc
· 11 months ago
I'm hardcore, tough New Yorker and a relentless, determined optimist, but I've been nauseous for a few days now. I literally can't eat knowing that Obama has slapped every gay American in the face, willingly, knowingly, and unapologetically. After eight years of Bush, how much more can gay people take??? I'm DONE with these politicians making nice then treating us like garbage. But what are my other options? Seriously, I'm asking.
red_dwarf
· 11 months ago
Will - I once heard, read, that, so long as you know "where" you are, then you're ok. Enjoy the snowfall. Be cheerful this holiday season, and enjoy your friends and company.
Knowing where you are is indicated by your statement that Obama "...willingly, knowingly, and unapologetically threw the LGBT community under the bus for political gain - knowing (he's not studpid) that it would send a clear message to intelligent people that "he lacks courage", "lacks a spine", because, as we know, he did it for political gain. You know as well as others that his argument that he wanted to be "inclusive" is bullshit.
So there you are will. Obama just handed out a plate of bullshit to the LGBT community - declaring, for all history, that he is spineless.
Now, enjoy the holidays and fight for your rights. I recommend that all LGBT participants in the inaugaration withdrawal immediately. If they do not, then I too will lose faith. Right now I believe in the LGBT community, that they will stand up for their rights, and fight, always. Now its time for action.
Forget Obama. He's already delcared who he is, another political whore. Maybe he'll change - who knows? But just be yourself will - and no worries brother - anyone with half a brain is with you.
willnyc
· 11 months ago
thanks. much needed. (sigh...)
gwyneth
· 11 months ago
I pledge allegiance to a flag that no longer stands for ALL of America What is a republic? What does it stand for? (for anyone who doesn't get it ;) one nation under fraud with liberty and justice for the Religious Christians only.
Avaruseget
· 11 months ago
Obama: I'm trying to bring people together, unrepentant gays in their gay homes can wait.
woodka
· 11 months ago
You know, the Christianists sure are enamored of a guy who hung out with a dozen men....
The Tim Channel
· 11 months ago
A fact I speculated on doing an am talk radio call in show at drive-time here in JACKSON MISS.
The phones at the station lit up like the opening ceremonies at the Chinese Olympic Games.
Enjoy.
RitornaVincitor
· 11 months ago
What these moron preachers fail to grasp is that according to Jesus, the church is supposed to be a refuge for sinners, not an assembly of the holy.
Laur
· 11 months ago
I wonder if Warren dresses up like Church Lady & does the "Superiority Dance" in private.
These evangelists who are so concerned with what adults do in their intimate relationships are more than a little bit obsessed.
I'm disappointed that the president-elect chose Warren. While it might be admirable to be willing to show civility to those who disagree with you, I would be just as offended if he wanted Rev. Hagee to serve the same function.
I guess this was an ill-conceived choice, made, perhaps to distance himself from the shitstorm the Right generated about Rev. Wright (who is still a better man than Warren).
KeithNovo
· 11 months ago
Well, that's the reason I left the Catholic Church! I am quite the unrepentent gay. In fact, the fools sent me envelopes for payment to their prostrifing ways. I left just over the bullying to vote prostrife, and I have stayed away to reject the perverse view of sex these eunichs for the kingdom of heaven have. Count me out of your cults of holier-than-thou. God laughs at human beings who claim to know what He thinks! I don't fall for Calvinisitic predestination that gays are damned to hell, so why should I fall for silly preachers who lie, cheat, and steal to further their own monetary gain in this world. Do they, like John Calvin Coolidge, really believe that financial prosperity in this life means they are part of the elite who will be saved? That went out with the Great Depression!
The Tim Channel
· 11 months ago
One needn't be an unrepentant homosexual running away from the bible because it discriminates against your undeniably 'queer' God given natural sexual orientation.
The only requirement is unrepentant intellectualism and rationality of a kind that disavows any supernatural claims of authority the bible represents, be they focused on inappropriate shellfish consumption, sexual orientation, or the appropriateness of offering your daughter's sexual services to strangers lest you be considered a poor host.
Enjoy.
triple7s
· 11 months ago
If gluttony is still a SIN, then why is the Rev trying to tell OTHER people how to live. He is obese and obviously has some problems of his OWN to deal with. Get REAL Rev. There is a village somewhere in the world that could live on what you obviously consume in a day. Why are so many of these MORAL POLICE types obese?
Laur
· 11 months ago
I think they're obese because of repressed sexuality. Lookit how pretty the manifestation is, in Warren's case: he advocates for discrimination against gay rights, he's against women having reproductive choice. Wants to take away rights. Wants to amend the Constitution!
For a guy who claims to promote Christian values, he has a funny way of showing it. It's a shame that anyone listens to him. He's not right with himself, and bestsellers won't make a difference.
P.S.--I haven't read his book. (1) I'm not into these "inspirational" books, and (2) the title is pretentious.
The Tim Channel
· 11 months ago
Proverbs 23:2 proclaims, "Put a knife to your throat if you are given to gluttony."
Amen.
Enjoy.
buddhacat
· 11 months ago
he is stuff his pain at not following his homosexual urges. What you resist persists in some other way .
Keith Renn
· 11 months ago
I saw this reported on tonight's (19 Dec 2008) MSNBC The Rachel Maddow Show. I don't like Rich Warren and his ILK... but I just checked-out www.saddleback.com and I CANNOT FIND this "Small Group Information" page containing this alleged denial of membership to "unrepentant" homosexuals. There IS a page that's entitled "Small Group Life" that has the SAME group picture as the one above as well as similar fonts, colors, design, etc. as well as links (which I visited) to other pages in the "Small Groups" realm -- but again, NO mention of denying membership to anyone for any reason. Anyone can FAKE a web page -- and while it's possible that the church has taken the page down, it's also possible that the page never existed. When a report or allegation like this is made it's imperative that the URL be provided, so that individuals can independently verify the veracity of the claim being made. Just my 2 cents...
Duke
· 11 months ago
Just follow the link in the original story above. It goes to the small group page. You can read the excerpted text then scroll up to the top of the page to see the graphics.
I also couldn't find the right web page o the Saddleback site. Eventually I did a search on "homosexual" and "member" and got a list linking to various pages, including one that clearly contained the wording shown above, on a page that said "Small Group Information" and included the same graphics.....but the text has clearly been removed from the website. Here's the link to the search list; look at #3: http://www.saddlebackfamily.com/search/index.ht...
RonNYC
· 11 months ago
Besides being ignorant and stupid (5000 years of blah blah ignorant crap), their website is also illiterate. "...would not be accepted at a member at Saddleback" should be "would be accepted as a member at Saddleback." "as", not "at". Also, just curious, I wonder why "Lordship" is capitalized but "leadership" is not. The man may have some temporary success, but he is truly quite stupid (I watched the Ann Curry interview 2nite). Quite stupid.
paulbe
· 11 months ago
But...why would you want to anyway?
INMINYMA
· 11 months ago
I found it by going to the main home page, selecting "Lake Forest" as the destination (the original/main "campus"), and typing "homosexuality" in the search field -- the Lake Forest page is the only one offering a search field.
It needs to be shouted loud that they are using the deceitful paraphrase called "The Living Bible" as their source for the hateful quotes. This is not an accurate translation of any original text -- it's not a translation at all, but a piece of propaganda parading as "the Bible."
Lauren1959
· 11 months ago
Keep up the good work; you made MSNBC last night with this article front and center.
tlsintx
· 11 months ago
dear Rick Warren, just because you're an ignorant bigot does not mean that you can't go on the world's largest all-gay Caribbean cruise...we hope you do! And maybe you'll get out of that closet and get healthy!! Bon Voyage.
ACS
· 11 months ago
Hee Hee!!!!! Too Funny, and VERY well put!~ :):):)
Erick
· 11 months ago
This whole conversation is bizarre. Despite what many wishful and uniformed thinkers think, The Bible does forbid homosexuality (Lev. 18:22). Christians who believe that there is nothing wrong with homosexuality are a part of the same slippage that has been taking place for centuries. All religions become watered down and moderate, even though the new way of doing things directly contradicts the initial beliefs.
Christianity is crazy...loony...kooky. A father induces the birth of himself in the womb of a virgin using the ghost of himself (Wah?). Get off your duffs people. Complainers who target Warren as the boogie man are ineffective. Until you are willing to call out Christianity for its backwards, bigoted, discriminatory behavior that influences the votes of millions of people, you are simply wasting time.
Erick
· 11 months ago
P.S. If John Kerry would have been elected...he would have had a Catholic priest give his inaugural prayer. Would anyone have cared? Something to think about. This is a red herring.
D Reed
· 11 months ago
Send your protest e-mail to info@barackobama.com.. let's see if we can stop this.. otherwise close your wallets and support for Obama.. red herring or not we deserve to be heard..we elected the bastard!!
mattycakes
· 11 months ago
So much for "Religion". It seems Rick's religion is "As he says only". If I recall "God" loves ALL. This is why Religions should be BANNED and again I say, anyone who wants to love GOD can, they don't have to belong to Religions that are MAN MADE!
Bill
· 10 months ago
"Religions should be BANNED"
So much for the First Amendment.
goodstoryteller
· 11 months ago
What about unrepentant fat people whose lifestyle includes devotion to eating to much.
buddhacat
· 11 months ago
or unrepentant liars who make up stories
Joe Plumber
· 11 months ago
Don't worry guys, he has had a change of heart. Since hating and banning gays is affecting his bottom line, he has decided to change his policy. Now you only have to be 25% repentive. It is the holiday special! Don't miss out! After the New Year it will be 50%, but of course if you order now you will be grandfathered in!
fat fairy
· 11 months ago
if you disagree with anything obama does that makes you racist. Racist gays? Two negatives make a positive!
K-in-PA
· 11 months ago
Rick Warren IS preaching the Word of God -- there ARE many references to the sin of homosexuality in the Bible. Saddleback Church, a non-denominational congregation, is just one church. Many major denominations also view 'practicing' homosexuality as sin, backed-up by scripture. None of these denominations or independent churches prohibit you from fellowshipping and worshiping God with them. However, to become a member, you must take vows -- something that seems to have little meaning these days. To profess these vows in public without any intention of changing what "may be" considered sin in the sight of God, is to lie to yourself, the congregation, and to God.
We are all sinners. Maybe the difference between the sin of an over-eater and the sin of practicing homosexual relations, is that the over-eater knows they are doing wrong and truly wants to change. The practicing homosexual doesn't acknowledge their activity as sin and therefore doesn't want to change -- or live a Godly life as outlined in the Bible. One day, we will all have to answer for our actions during our earthly life.
The greatest thing about God is that he loves "EVERYONE" so much, that he gives them a choice. The choice to live according to his ways, or the choice to ignore his love and offer of salvation for the fleshly, selfish pleasures of ourselves.
That's my sermon for the day!
Joe M
· 11 months ago
Excuse me, if you arent gay why do you care? maybe you want to be gay but LIE to yourself about it ? Mind your own business before you preach about some one else
Chuck Prentiss
· 11 months ago
Obama should have invited his long-time pastor, Jeremiah Wright, to give the inaugural invocation. As we can now clearly see, Reverend Wright is a lot less controversial than Rick Warren. And, Reverend Wright is neither Christ-ophobic nor homophobic.
ganjamon
· 11 months ago
If being homosexual is a sin against the body as temple, is being obese in the same category? And is being an obese Christian a lesser sin than being a fit homosexual Christian - or the same?
Personally, I believe organized religion is an oxymoron: How can something so individual as a relationship with Jesus be organized? Perhaps religion is the opiate to the masses...
katwmn
· 10 months ago
You can believe the Fundamentalist Christian anacronym, God Abhors You if you like, but I suspect God Adores You is the tr uth. To believe that God does not condone homosexuality is absurd. He/She created it.
floyd
· 10 months ago
Not quite gone -- see http://www.saddlebackfamily.com/maturity/fullst... where another author, Tom Holladay, contends that "every one of those studies" about inherent homosexuality has been proven false. While Rick Warren may be distancing himself, the website does not.
allen
· 7 months ago
The bible is clear. Homosexuality is a sin. Cites and nations have been destroyed because of it. God make the rules. It is a choice. Good luck.
All Comments
Barack is looking like Dubya in his unwillingness to admit a mistake. Either that or he doesn't think it's a mistake, which is even worse.
You don't want to burn in hell for eternity, do you?
Come and feel the conditional "love" we have for you.
Closeted, psychically damaged gays with wives and kids: good. They can be recruited for Warren's version of Jesus. And they can drop $$$ in the plate.
Liberated, psychically integrated gays with partners: bad.
Liberated, psychically integrated gays with partners and kids: very bad. No $$$ there.
We it comes to the GLBT community we are still riding at the back of the Obama bus.
On a side note, it's good to see the T back in place with the GLB. Let's not be so quick to throw our fellow warriors under the bus like so many of us were ready to do, just a few months ago. Imagine how they felt when the Gs Ls and Bs turned their backs on them in order to improve their own chances at equality.
The website pretty much says that any study done about gays is wrong. And even if they were right, they are still wrong.
Perhaps they meant "..AS a member..."? Nothing makes me more nuts than a bigot who doesn't proof read.
But apparently they will accept divorcees, even though Jesus explicitly says that "anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery.'" Matthew 19:3-9 This is probably because, if they barred all divorcees from membership, 3/4 of their pews would be empty and so would their coffers.
http://www.theonion.com/content/news/americas_f...
WHAT YOU CAN DO:
1. CALL/EMAIL Emmett Belivau, Executive Director/CEO of the Inaugural Committee:
Phone:202-203-1715
Email: emmett@pic2009.org
2. SEND a letter letting the transition team know what you think here http://change.gov/page/content/contact, and
3. EMAIL Parag Mehta, Obama's LGBT liaison on the transition team at parag.mehta@ptt.gov.
Let your voices be heard and send emails to the members of Joint Congressional Committee on Inaugural Ceremonies as well.
Sen. Dianne Feinstein
http://feinstein.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?Fu...
Sen. Harry Reid
http://reid.senate.gov/contact/index.cfm
Sen. Bob Bennett
http://bennett.senate.gov/contact/email_form.cfm
Rep. Nancy Pelosi
http://speaker.house.gov/contact/
Rep. Steny Hoyer
http://hoyer.house.gov/contact/email.asp
Rep. John Boehner
http://johnboehner.house.gov/Contact/
Here's my letter, succinct as I can be:
Barack Obama's victory over fear and hate was a historic event, about which we are tremendously proud.
Rick Warren is on the wrong side of history. Elevating him to the privilege of speaking at the Inauguration is wrong.
We urge you to convey to the President-Elect that he, and we as a nation, are ill-served by this decision.
Sincerely,
firstly, let me answer the question that is always used here and everywhere, "will obama do this if it was the black communityy and invite a racist?"
ANSWER: if the public view was at least 50/50 on this issue , probably YES, YES , YES. (em Obama would not be president anyways with views on the black community being that way, so maybe you would be having hillary- hell hillary would have no chance either - so probably you would be asking mccain)
if you recall, in the past with interacial marriage, black rights, em, half of the people in congress were KKK members or proud friends of one, the other half were "REACHING ACCROSS" to them.
so in conclusion, this all depends on the society we live in, the american society is 50/50 on this issue (gay marriage), so this is what happens. in canada where i live in, our society has moved on, that is the ONLY reason why gay marriage is a non-issue here and a HOT MESS in the U.S.A.
that's all folks.
i would start complaining if he starts making homophobic policies, till then i will SHUT UP, but i do understand where you are coming from.
Why are people so thick to get this through their heads?
Saddleback was specifically for Warren's followers and on Warren's property, the inaguration is for the entire country and on public lands.
Totally different thing.
Why would I want to join that church?
Why is it STILL ok to bash gays and get away with it!?
I have to say, I do get a similar vibe from Warren. Anyone else?
-S
He's banning gays, oh wait those with the "homosexual lifestyle" (typical words of a HOMOPHOBE).
Is that what Jesus would do? I don't think so!
This is a cardboard cut out of Rick Warren shaking hands with Jesus to PLAINLY DISCRIMINATE against Out LGBTQ people. Can anyone truly argue that this creed should be defended without playing devil's advocate?
We (speaking as a gay American) put up with enough "Wait for your turn, right now the bigger problems come first" bullshit. To have this guy speak at the Inauguration means I'm doubling my efforts travel to Washington to hold a sign for my man Obama to see.
I donated money that could've gone to rent to get him elected, I wore my Obama Pride sticker proudly, and now I feel ashamed to defend my president-elect in the midst of my own people.
Where's Drudge, NBC, CNN, or FOX to actually pick up something that matters to the GLBTQ community? Covering Blagojevich saying AGAIN that he's innocent and won't back down. Ploy to be tougher on Obama? Oh wait, polls show that voters aren't and won't tie Obama to Blago.
The hypocrisy is startling and, as the bumper stickers exclaim:
IF YOU'RE NOT OUTRAGED, YOU HAVEN'T BEEN PAYING ATTENTION!
But, hey, they won't stop you from attending and I bet when they pass the plate around they will take your money.
At the restaurant in Hell the favored dish of deceased evangelicals is levitical linguini, garnished with shellfish sauteed in saintly sauce. The Devil is hand preparing a big batch, eagerly awaiting the arrival of Mr. Warren. They'll have a discussion on biblical FOCUS right before the dark avenger flings Warren's flabby crab eating soul into the hellfire of eternal damnation.
The rotisserie the Devil uses for roasting pork (a favorite of the sinning Jews) drips grease on the burning bodies of the godless crab eaters. The resulting smoke and flame adds a slightly nutty and mysterious flavor to the pork that heightens it's appeal. No two smoked pigs ever quite taste the same. They tend to vary from person to person. It's part of the appeal of the dish.
Enjoy.
(We don't want you arrested throwing them at him. But wait, we could just leave it at the stage?).
So, the rest of us have to accept Fat F#ck Warren and his bigoted shit, but he can turn us away when it suits him.
I see how it is, Obama.
Screw you.
Bush did not invent "either your with us or against us."
Maybe Obama's philosophy and actions won't work.
But the last 30 years sure haven't
I am simply tired of anyone banning anyone.
Tell ya what John and others...go to DC..and on the 20th
commit an act of civil disobedience...get arrested..
have the local government jail you for your beliefs.
Seriously John...in the 8 years of Bush.
How many times have you placed yourself in a position of arrest
to physically assert your beliefs?
Maybe you missed out on the Bush years..
I await your demonstration of commitment on the first day of the Obama years...
One my my seven since 2003
http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_4099557
(and yeah that's my pic..and yeah I fasted during my incarceration)
You all are pissed off...cool
If this is not worth arrest for you...what is?
I'm sick of our so-called progressive friends telling us that our struggle is somehow inferior to, well; everyone else's.
The underlying belief of the "inclusive" Obama apologists is the same as Warren's (which is probably why you are o.k. with this choice), and that is: homosexuality is a choice and therefore not really the same as being a woman or being black or being...whatever. You can dress it up any way you like, but that is what you and Obama are saying loud and clear with this choice and with your apologies.
And as for the gays who are apologizing for Obama's choice, I just can't even to begin to fathom what is going on in your heads. What is the gay equivalent of an 'Uncle Tom'. Log Cabin?
And to the op: Wow. You've been to jail a few times for your so-called beliefs: its all window dressing, as your words betray the fact that you don't even believe your own b.s.
The bigots and apologists apparently thought teh gays would just continue sitting down and shutting up. Well, those days are fucking over. I'm going to call out bigotry when I see it and if that makes some so-called liberals uncomfortable in their own skin so be it.
Lot's of people are now trying to say that civil rights equality is a "fringe" or "far left" idea. Fine. This radical is going to get in their face every step of way then. Tough shit if people don't like it.
Way to go Barry! Stop all the dissent so that you don't have to answer.
There is nothing that Barry can say or do to gloss over the overt hatred that Warren and his ATM, I mean "church", demonstrates on its website.
Maybe Barry can come spew more of the same bullshit he spewed at his nomination in Denver. We'd all believe that right about now, wouldn't we?
*ALL* TV preachers have one....
But seriously, fighting never got me anything. Talking sense, building consensus, that's where it's at. Only fight when you are in mortal peril.
Prop 8 is the sound of homophobia on its deathbed.
I think any intelligent activism has to be aware of the form of people's prejudices. Only flex your muscles when strategically necessary, but always balance it with positive cultural work (philanthropy, PR, and dialogue).
I think Harvey Milk is a good example of the kind of leadership that is lacking right now. MLK is also another good example.
that will result in arrest in protest? cool! (of course it will effect your resume.)
It's just going to justify segregation to an easily frightened public.
/snark/
Hmmmm. Sounds like more than a few at Saddleback have a guilty conscience.
Besides, I'm Jewish.
except on protecting the envioroment.
and on providing education for the disadvantaged.
and literacy projects.
and helping the poor.
and fighting aids.
and promoting reconciliation.
and it's not "our inauguration".
I'll give you one thing Mr. F key. You are consistently one of the most ignorant,(and arrogantly so) posters that trolls this site. Do you come here to vent only because none of your favorite conservative websites HAVE comment sections?
And stated why in two paragraphs. Maybe every GLBT
person who is a suscriber should do the same
On 1/20 ...Obama will be your President...ya want to make a point?
Quit your job...spend every day picketing the White House..
Make your physical resistance...visible.
Ya gotta a little more than unsubscribe...although that is a start...
However, you have completely redeemed yourself in my eyes with this latest revelation. This is ABSOLUTELY and completely relevant to this issue and the outrage that it has generated. I can't imagine a more perfect example of how absurd it is to "reach out" and give a place of honor at this year’s inauguration (which CONTRARY to many people's assertion is THE PEOPLE'S event, NOT the president's alone). How can he possibly justify adding this man to the lineup, in a place of honor, at an event that is supposed to bring EVERYONE together when this man SPECIFICALLY and UNIQUELY denies membership to his church to ONLY ONE group of "sinners" and proudly says so on his church’s "saddlebackFAMILY' website. He says nothing about denying membership to ANY other people or groups of people based on their “sin”. They actually say on their FAMILY page that unrepentant gays are not welcome in their family.
If we knew NOTHING more about this man, this revelation alone should disqualify him from having this place of honor on this day of celebrating and honoring inclusion AND those who INCLUDE.
It would be no different if Obama had an as inauguration speaker a person who owned a country club that disallowed blacks.
This is OUTRAGEOUS.
It's a tough line, because I fully support their right to interpret the Bible as they believe to be true, and I'm not trying to force their church to do anything that goes against their beliefs. But it still feels like a kick in the gut, especially so soon after the passage of Prop 8. And I feel so bad for those kids already born who are gay but don't know it yet or haven't accepted it yet. That church is so large there have got to be a ton of already-gay kids who are growing up in an environment that judges them to be sick and sinners just because of who God made them.
Enjoy.
We have been duped and screwed by Obama. I hope the Obama cultists will finally wake up from the Kool-Aid buzz!
Obama screwed up. What makes all of this dissapointing, as I pointed out to will from NYC above - is that he comes back with this bullshit response about "being inclusive". Homophobia is NEVER acceptable, period. Obama knows that. But Obama is looking to 2012. Personally, after what he just did, I can't stand to look at the man any longer. I have lost ALL respect for him. Anyone who embraces bigotry and homophobia are losers in my world, spineless cowards. Nothing more, nothing less.
The biggest issue facing those who took the time to 'blog in'? on some poll he did last week was drug legalization. THE BIGGEST ISSUE. THE ONE MOST PRESSING TO MOST PEOPLE.
He's an honest doper who has hit the big time. Let's see how he deals with the rest of us. That will be REALLY telling.
Enjoy.
Obama should have known better. This part is almost as bad as Warren himself.
If not, I would seriously wonder what (and how much) he has to hide.
After eight years of Bush, how much more can gay people take???
I'm DONE with these politicians making nice then treating us like garbage.
But what are my other options? Seriously, I'm asking.
Knowing where you are is indicated by your statement that Obama "...willingly, knowingly, and unapologetically threw the LGBT community under the bus for political gain - knowing (he's not studpid) that it would send a clear message to intelligent people that "he lacks courage", "lacks a spine", because, as we know, he did it for political gain. You know as well as others that his argument that he wanted to be "inclusive" is bullshit.
So there you are will. Obama just handed out a plate of bullshit to the LGBT community - declaring, for all history, that he is spineless.
Now, enjoy the holidays and fight for your rights. I recommend that all LGBT participants in the inaugaration withdrawal immediately. If they do not, then I too will lose faith. Right now I believe in the LGBT community, that they will stand up for their rights, and fight, always. Now its time for action.
Forget Obama. He's already delcared who he is, another political whore. Maybe he'll change - who knows? But just be yourself will - and no worries brother - anyone with half a brain is with you.
(sigh...)
that no longer stands for ALL of America
What is a republic? What does it stand for?
(for anyone who doesn't get it ;)
one nation
under fraud
with liberty and justice for the Religious Christians only.
The phones at the station lit up like the opening ceremonies at the Chinese Olympic Games.
Enjoy.
These evangelists who are so concerned with what adults do in their intimate relationships are more than a little bit obsessed.
I'm disappointed that the president-elect chose Warren. While it might be admirable to be willing to show civility to those who disagree with you, I would be just as offended if he wanted Rev. Hagee to serve the same function.
I guess this was an ill-conceived choice, made, perhaps to distance himself from the shitstorm the Right generated about Rev. Wright (who is still a better man than Warren).
The only requirement is unrepentant intellectualism and rationality of a kind that disavows any supernatural claims of authority the bible represents, be they focused on inappropriate shellfish consumption, sexual orientation, or the appropriateness of offering your daughter's sexual services to strangers lest you be considered a poor host.
Enjoy.
For a guy who claims to promote Christian values, he has a funny way of showing it. It's a shame that anyone listens to him. He's not right with himself, and bestsellers won't make a difference.
P.S.--I haven't read his book. (1) I'm not into these "inspirational" books, and (2) the title is pretentious.
Amen.
Enjoy.
http://www.saddlebackfamily.com/membership/grou...
It needs to be shouted loud that they are using the deceitful paraphrase called "The Living Bible" as their source for the hateful quotes. This is not an accurate translation of any original text -- it's not a translation at all, but a piece of propaganda parading as "the Bible."
Christianity is crazy...loony...kooky. A father induces the birth of himself in the womb of a virgin using the ghost of himself (Wah?). Get off your duffs people. Complainers who target Warren as the boogie man are ineffective. Until you are willing to call out Christianity for its backwards, bigoted, discriminatory behavior that influences the votes of millions of people, you are simply wasting time.
So much for the First Amendment.
We are all sinners. Maybe the difference between the sin of an over-eater and the sin of practicing homosexual relations, is that the over-eater knows they are doing wrong and truly wants to change. The practicing homosexual doesn't acknowledge their activity as sin and therefore doesn't want to change -- or live a Godly life as outlined in the Bible. One day, we will all have to answer for our actions during our earthly life.
The greatest thing about God is that he loves "EVERYONE" so much, that he gives them a choice. The choice to live according to his ways, or the choice to ignore his love and offer of salvation for the fleshly, selfish pleasures of ourselves.
That's my sermon for the day!
Personally, I believe organized religion is an oxymoron: How can something so individual as a relationship with Jesus be organized? Perhaps religion is the opiate to the masses...