DISQUS

Butch1 · 11 months ago

"Warren wrote Time magazine's egregious puff piece on Nigerian archbishop Peter Akinola, and supported Ugandan archbishop Henry Orombi's decision to boycott the Lambeth Conference because supporters of an openly gay bishop would be there."
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Warren isn't even Episcopalian and he's butting his nose into their business. He seems to have a huge problem with homosexuality in general and we know from experience that those types can be "closet-cases."

elrojo · 11 months ago

California Attorney General Jerry Brown asks California Supreme Court to invalidate Prop 8:

http://www.mercurynews.com/samesexmarriage/ci_1...

smallhandff · 11 months ago

So, has that gay marching band cancelled their inaugural parade appearance yet or will they be wearing white hoods as part of their uniform?

kevinbgoode · 11 months ago

I'm wondering why all of those gay organizations haven't cancelled their inaugeral ball/party plans in Washington. Surely they are not going to all this expense merely to celebrate the huge political gain of getting a band to march in the parade as "representative" of how "inclusive" my government is of our community.

wooo hoo....the band marching sure made me feel a whole lot better about the loss of my rights.

General Zod · 11 months ago

How many threads will John have about Rick Warren between now and Inauguration Day? Over 1000? My guess is way more than that, because we all know that the #1 pressing issue in the country is kissing the gay communities ass, over and over......... Recession, Unemployment, Home Foreclosure - FUCK THAT SHIT - Obama dissed teh gays!!!!!!!

And in 3 months nobody will remember it. no-body-eee. Except the people like our little Johnny, who sees gay-haters everywhere,

grow the fuck up, and stop worrying about insignifigant shit just because it gives you a little soapbox to get up on and chirp. Christ, what a little whining queen you are. You hate winning almost as much as losing.

petra glyph · 11 months ago

Relax, obviously we all need to vent a little here. We don't have many outlets at the moment and John is giving us the space we need to express how frustrated we are. Obama is the one that set the culture war to nuclear, complain to him.

LTMidknite · 11 months ago

You can have used this argument 24 hours ago.

Right now, it's John and Joe trying to keep people here as pissed off as possible for as long as possible and as non-constructively as possible.

kevinbgoode · 11 months ago

Speaking of whining. . .I'm sure your citizenship rights are just as insignificant to this President-elect as mine.

evan_la · 11 months ago

"Obama dissed teh gays!!!!!!!"

And, so what would you have us do? Thank him?

cowboyneok · 11 months ago

Unemployment? You mean the legal ability to fire gays and lesbians because they are perceived to be LGBT? It happens all the time, and its legal in most states. You mean the inability of LGBT community to protect their families because we can't get the same marriage protections? No, we don't want to get married in your nasty Talibangelical churches, we want CIVIL RIGHTS and by G-d they aren't called CIVIL RIGHTS for nothing. Every American is SUPPOSED to get them no matter what. LGBT don't get all of them... Civil Rights aren't insignificant shit. Tell ya what, I'll take away yours and see where YOU stand on the issue.

fdeblauwe · 11 months ago

I find my opinion on this matter nicely summarized at the ResaonsToBeCheerful3.blogspot.com blog: "Mega-Rev. Rick Warren in numbers." It quantifies what he is searched in connection with in Google and computes a "progressiveness" (or lack thereof) result. Tongue in cheek statistics of course but revealing/funny for sure.

NGLTF · 11 months ago

On the website of his church, Rev Warren quotes Leviticus (the part where it calls homosexuality an abomination). But he very carefully stopped the quotation because just a few sentences later, it say "they shall be put to death". The sneaky fundies always do that. They know that if they quote the very next sentence in Leviticus, it will be obvious that they are hate mongers. I wish a journalist would ask Warren about that. If he's going to use Leviticus in an argument, why does he conveniently edit it?

Bostonian_Queer_in_Dallas · 11 months ago

And they conveniently omit the rest of Levitican law...stoning unruly kids to death...planting crops in the wrong field...shrimp, shellfish...a woman in temple during her period...neighbor unemployed...yup all stoned to death...keeping slaves...we are the only part of Leviticus they like to quote. Why? Brings in bucks to their Jesus Show.

kevinbgoode · 11 months ago

I think at this point we need to be asking President-Elect Barack "Separate but Equal" Obama why he so deeply respects Warren's work with AIDS patients and poverty in Africa yet does not find his persecution of the civil rights of gay AMERICANS more than simply a "disagreement."

I have seen little effort on the part of the Obama campaign to include the unity of the gay community as an equal partner in this government; moreover, we are still put in a position of struggling for our goddamned birthright as free citizens in this country while he panders to the oppressive, insecure people who personally selected "religious" beliefs which dictate they attack and persecute my citizenship rights.

It is already an outrage that thousands of gay men and lesbians have had to face the humiliation of being denied the basic right to serve their nation. And when that conflict extends to a denial of the basic right to legally secure a loving relationship between two supposedly FREE adults, then it is quite obvious to ANY politician that this Constitution is an empty piece of paper to our community.

It is also quite clear that it was the Obama campaign which, for all its talk about outreach to those whom "disagree," failed to conduct any effective outreach with the very community who supported his candidacy. He apparently views my citizenship as just as worthless and as expendable as any heterosupremacist Republican.

NGLTF · 11 months ago

I almost puked when Obama said he "deeply respected Rick Warren" but just disagreed with him on some things. I would love to ask Obama if there are people he deeply respects but simply disagrees with them because for instance they thing Blacks need to go back to Africa, or Mexicans are too greasy. How can Obama overlook gays being called pedophiles, but none of the other insults?

LTMidknite · 11 months ago

And THIS is exactly what I'm talking about.

John and Joe are on their way to successfully turning "America"BLOG into a site that breeds hate.

I hope they're happy.

red_dwarf · 11 months ago

LTMidknite - you sound like someone right out of the 1950s. Thanks for your weasel response.

Shannon · 11 months ago

SIMP

Shannon · 11 months ago

Because Obummer is a fraud.......he lied to us all collectively to get our votes, now he is too stupid to show any appreciation.

Demo_Dave · 11 months ago

I'm sure everyone at some point who is not straight had to expect this. Every election they rev us up to get us to work for them and donate money and then they run over us...Same shit different day.

Chris From Maine · 11 months ago

Rick Warren hates people simply because of the way the were born. It is the same as people who hate, say, black people because of the way they were born.

Would Obama allow a radical KKK preacher to give the invocation at his inauguration? Of course not.

It shows that gays are still second class citizens in this country, and it doesnt look like "change" will be coming to that anytime soon.

smiling_dog · 11 months ago

Well, John, I'm sure he's in favor of it. Are you asking if he would admit that he's in favor of it? I doubt it. Does he hate gays? Of course. Would he just come out and say that? I doubt it. Does he think homosexuality is immoral? Sure. Does he come out and say that? Sort of. Does his selection by Obama up his status with his base of Palinite Christians? I'm not sure. Maybe they think of him as a sell out. Anyone know?
Is he really a bad example of clergy or is he pretty darn typical of what's out there. He isn't that far off of your typical Catholic priest or bishop in terms of his views on abortion and homosexuality (or heterosexuality for that matter). Maybe we can focus on why we should even bother putting these demagogues up on the public stage talking like they have some sort of fix on what God wants us to do with our lives and our sex organs. Do we still have to find someone who is the "right kind" of clergy for our Liberal sensibilities? Because, for me, that would be no clergy at all. I'm tired of this faux love of Christianity B.S. that politicians play. Truthfully, I doubt Obama takes religion all that seriously. I think that George W. Bush did and Jimmy Carter did, but most of the rest of them (well, I suppose Reagan, but I have my doubts) just play along for the need to play along.

Richard Armstrong · 11 months ago

It's positive of Obama to be inclusive. It could lead his administration to greater productivity not to mention good will. But, Dr. Warren is too controversial to bring on stage right now, especially after the success of prop 8 in California.

The first acknowledgment of support should be to those who willingly supported the president-elect. They are first tier constituents. There are plenty of ways to work with Dr. Warren. However, let's not begin with him. Obama is a strong supporter of LGBT, along with his other core constituents, they should be first in line to receive his gratitude.
Richard Armstrong, CA

red_dwarf · 11 months ago

"Obama is a strong supporter of LGBT"

Strong? I don't think so Richard. Remove that word and then I would agree with you.

Rational · 11 months ago

This is about Civil rights.
It is about whether some delusional people can use their delusions to deny any segment of the population equal rights.
Anyone who argues this is simply about the Gay community is blind to the reality.
At this time the Gay community is serving as the Canary in the Coal mine a way of warning us all of the potential danger that a man who is willing to lie, to insult and to demean those he refuse to accept his dominance is to all of humanity.
So we heard it in the 50's that it's just a Black thing learn to live with it.
In East Timor we saw the same thing as the Indonesians felt that the East timor people were unworthy of equality.
Today we still hear it about woman ( from the same man) who have to learn to just accept their place.
The issue of homosexuals is only the nose of the camel trying to bring in two humps full of prejudice, bigotry, hypocricy and injustice into the tent.
Well I am sorry I do not think the tent is, or should be, big enough to offer shelter to the purveyors of this filth.

red_dwarf · 11 months ago

"Well I am sorry I do not think the tent is, or should be, big enough to offer shelter to the purveyors of this filth."

Exactly the truth Ken. We are a secular socieity with LIBERTY and JUSTICE for ALL. Asswipes like Warren have no place in our government as spokespersons, though they have the right to teach, speak and believe anything they want. The DO NOT have the right to stand up on center stage and spew their hate in a way that is legitimized by our incoming President. Obama made a seriously bad calculation. Whether he lives to regret it is up to the LGBT community.

I am reminded of the release of the Silent Movie "The Birth of a Nation" which was nothing more then a propaganda film inspring the rise of the KKK in the early 20th Century. The president at the time, Woodrow Wilson, gave a "thumbs up" to this homophobic garbage.

It matters not that Obama believes marriage is between a man and a woman, or that some asswipe like Warren believes that marriage is between a man and woman. Under the Constitituion cause must be shown, and the highest cause, to suppress the civil rights of its citizens. Let them show cause, and when they raise the bible in their hands tell them to go straight to hell - theology is NOT LAW!

Maldoror · 11 months ago

I swear I saw him cuddling up with some ladyboys last time I was in Thailand. I guess that doesn't count as homeosexuality because they LOOK like women.

jane · 11 months ago

Whatever happened to gluttony being a sin? Rick Warren needs to spend a little less time reading his poorly translated book of fables, and a little more time on a treadmill.

Bostonian_Queer_in_Dallas · 11 months ago

"Poorly translated"...amen sister Jane. Unless Ricky has studied Hebrew and Aramaic seriously, and for many years, which I doubt, he has misread Leviticus anyway. The Torah (first five books of the Bible) uses the word "schicksa" for abomination. Now Ricky probably has a Gentile wife. And in the New York area, anyway, when a nice Jewish boy dates or marries a WASP girl, the nickname Shicksa is bandied about for her. So Ricky let me just tell you that your own wife is EQUAL to my anal intercourse...according to the Torah laws laid out in Leviticus....got that? Your wife, and my dick in my husband's ass are identical in ancient Hebrew. It's called schicksa.

Ya see the problem with these white trash Baptist seminaries, unlike Harvard Div school, is they don't require Hebrew and Aramaic for a doctorate.

sherifffruitfly · 11 months ago

Let it be acknowledged that he's THEWORLDSBIGGESTGAYHATEREVERINTHEHISTORYOFHUMANITYANDEVERYDGENUSCONCEIVED.

Now tell me precisely where we go from that assumption.

red_dwarf · 11 months ago

I am a heterosexual, not that it matters, and I'd like to say this to the LGBT community - my point being is that I am not biased, just an American citizen wanting ALL citizens to have equal rights, under the Law, and under the Consititution.

I think we can all agree that Obama lacked the courage to stand up to Americans and say:

"...we are no longer going to stand by and degrade our LGBT brothers and sisters, we are all Americans and we are ALL going to share in the Liberty bought and paid for by our ancestors, many who gave their lives for ALL of us."

Because Obama lacked the courage and willfully threw the LGBT coummunity under the bus I no longer respect him though I hold out hope that he will change. This act is not forgiveable, nor is it acceptable. Ok, so what's next?

Since Obama lacked the will, determination and courage to act the LGBT community must now do so. It is time to stand up and tell America you have had ENOUGH. It is no longer acceptable to legitimize insane homophobes like Warren, and this must stop.

You MUST boycott the inaugaration - including the gay preacher, the gay band, the gay anything. If you do not you are ligitimizing Obama. If you, the LGBT community, do not have the courage and determination to stand up now, when it is time, to send America the message that you have had enough of this bullshit, then YOU TOO will demonstrate that you lack the courage to stand up and fight for your rights.

Boycott, in EVERY way, the inauagration. You are in a fight for your life, your rights and for the next generation of the LGBT community. Do not let them down. Have the courage that Obama lacked. Demonstrate to the world that you have had enough. It is your fight, it is my fight, it is a fight for freedom.

Get it done. now.

cowboyneok · 11 months ago

AMEN and PLEASE repeat this as much as possible to my community. I am ready to organize a HUNGER STRIKE if it becomes called for. I am NOT wanting to do this, but I will because the next LGBT lives are at stake and I've already lived half my life... Its time for me to start sacrificing for the future of the next generation.

I think our community should START by NOT partying during the Inauguration. At least those of us who are FORTY and over should CHOOSE not to party! Let the young ones do whatever... but those of us old enough to have "lived a life" need to start doing some non-violent resistance for change.

Shannon · 11 months ago

What is the big debate??? Warren is a freak and so is Obummer..............remember when Obummer voted to let the government keep on spying on us all effectively eliminating the 4th Amendment? Well we were shocked and could not understand why he would do that, the answer is getting more clear by the day.......the guy is a big fraud, he fooled us into thinking he was going to be different, now he has chosen all the same old crooks to surround himself with, he has no intention of ending the warmongering............and he has decided to throw his former liberal gay and women supporters over board because he has what he wanted from us. He thinks he no longer needs to pretend with us. We are glad he has finally "come out", too bad it is a couple of months too late for us to support a third party candidate..........fool us once, fool us twice, we just keep believing bullshit and getting fooled again.

timncguy · 11 months ago

I am still waiting to find an answer to this question.

Obama was a memeber of the UCC (United Church of Christ) for over 20 years. The UCC supports marriage equaltiy and performs religious marriage cerimnnies for same-sex couples. So, how can Obama continue to say he opposes same-sex marriage on religious grounds?

pdxprobert · 11 months ago

The same way many Catholics use birth control pills when the Pope is againts them... All religion is served buffet style... pick and choose what you like and leave the rest behind... I think what Obama says about gay marriage is more politically motivated than it is his firmly held belief... I wonder how would he feel if one of his daughters was a lesbian and not able to have the full benefits, privilieges and rights afforded to heterosexuals?

timncguy · 11 months ago

well DUH, of course it is politically motivated. So much for Change we can BELIEVE in, huh?

And, as far as the daughter question, maybe he could just get advice from Dick Cheney on that one.

This whole issue is because it is still acceptable to bash gays and athiets in this society with impunity. And Obama's stated position of believing that anti-gay bigotry is a firmly held moral belief based in religion and deserving of discussion and compromise does NOTHING to improve the situation. Obama would make no such statement about racism, anti-semitism or any other "ism". But, he is comfortable making that statement about gays. Obama is PART OF THE PROBLEM.

Steve_in_CNJ · 11 months ago

the most challenging idea there is 'compromise'. tell me how to compromise between first and second class. put us in class 1.5? is that obama's compromise? obviously he thinks Warren is in class 1 since he's straight.

timncguy · 11 months ago

I hope the gay band DOES march in the parade. I also hope they do so without playing a single note. Just make it a protest march.

me · 11 months ago

They (pro Prop 8) have just announced ttat they are going to try to annul the marriages. Tell me who to support and who to donate to who will actually be a reasonable strong community for egual rights and you have all my support. Who?

Sling Shot · 11 months ago

Warren's mouth is full of curses of deceit and fraud. He is far from the law and his mischief will return upon his own head.

samiinh · 11 months ago

I'm waiting anxiously for his drug dealer/gay prostitute to come forward. Any day now. How delicious that would be. Jeffy where are you????

cowboyneok · 11 months ago

No, I think he is straight. He is the flavor of straight though who might have secretly screwed around on his wife. Not sure about that one. I do think he is straight from watching him. He projects his gargantuoun appetite onto all others though. He honestly thinks everyone has the same desire to screw anything that moves as long as "the parts fit" or in his world (it has big tits)... His stereotypical comment about gays asking him why shouldn't they be able to have sex with anyone they want gave him away. He obviously hasn't talked to the gays or lesbians I go to church with. The gay "church lady" lesbians I know would not appreciate those comments AT ALL!

http://www.marlerblog.com/uploads/image/church%...

Pastor Warren if you burn for desire for a woman you get married... that is the biblical answer right? Well, what is the gay answer to that? Celebacy isn't an answer for EVERYONE. Gay people should be able to marry, and have families as well. Especially since straight people can't ever seem to perfect their "version" or fantasies of marriage.

afafkd · 11 months ago

likely there will not be a second term, and these will be amongst the reasons

Steve_in_CNJ · 11 months ago

where does Obama stand on criminalizing blackness?

cowboyneok · 11 months ago

Question: Whenever Pastor Rick Warren wants to f*ck one of those "beautiful women" he talked about in his video interview below what does he do?

A. Pray?
B. Eat a donut?

Answer: Look at his gut.

timncguy · 11 months ago

I saw those comments and what struck me is that the only comments Warren wanted to talk about re gays was they they always told him about wanting to have multiple sexual partners. To which he replied about his own desire (which he keeps in check) about wanting to screww every good looking woman he sees.

Where was Warren's discussion about gays who want to have a loving, monogamous, long-term relationship?

cowboyneok · 11 months ago

That was the exact same thing that struck me.

pissedoffliberal · 11 months ago

This is not a liberal site this is a hate site, and it disgusts me. I don't care about Rick Warren, I don't like him. But he represents a group of Americans who should be heard simply because they are Americans. This kind of behavior is why everything is so polarized right now. You are following the politics of George Bush. I am ashamed to see this kind of behavior. And I know this is hard to believe but Obama does believe in equal rights for gays because he said he doesn't impose his views on others. His picking of Warren does not change that. He has a 95 score from the HRC and now all of a sudden he is a bigot. You are the guy that went on TV and proudly called Barack Obama a bigot to David Schuster right? The President elect is a good man, and by calling him a bigot you made yourself look extremely petty, and I am ashamed for you. I am proud to have a president elect who listens to people with all views. Heaven forbid someone should actually want to represent everyone and heaven forbid someone should want us united. I am proud of Barack Obama for doing this when he knew he would have a backlash because of it. He doesn't deserve to be spit on by you. Shame on all of you people.... You are proving to be no different from the people you are so mad at. Many gays understand his decision, but you have to throw a pity party. And it's not even about the fact that you are upset, because I understand that. It's about the fact that you are harassing someone for trying to do a good thing. Congratulations.

kevinbgoode · 11 months ago

Really? So. . .tell me. . .where are the views of the white supremacists in the inaugeration? What? They are missing? Well how could that be, when we know the President-elect "separate but equal" Obama wants to engage ALL points of view?

Apparently the "all points of view" on the public stage is only reserved for those who actively campaign to REMOVE the rights of the gay community. No other minority group is treated that way.

Corey Mondello · 11 months ago

Shut up!

anastasjoy · 11 months ago

OK, I just snapped. Warren supported the despicable Akinola, who is being used as a stooge by Republican front group the Institute for Religion and Democracy to rip apart the Episcopal Church just as they're trying to do to the Presbytarian Church and several others? A step too far. I totally turned on Hillary when she cozied up to IRD funder Richard Mellon Scaife, and I'm really pissed now. Time to make another call to the obama inauguration committee. And listen, pissoffliberal, as many have explained, this isn't about "being heard." This is about a specific individual who is homophobic, misogynistic and borderline anti-Semitic being elevated to the EXCLUSIVE position of representing ALL Americans in delivering the inauguration invocation. It's not like he's one of several and other voices are being heard as well. HE is THE voice. There isn't any way to justify that.

Jennifer · 11 months ago

Akinola is the scum of the earth and a murdering, bloodthirsty, power-hungry pig. Anyone who would allow themselves to even be suspected of supporting the likes of this worm deserves not even contempt. This appointment can't stand. Warren is a fascist.

paulbe · 11 months ago

Obama is looking like an even bigger puppet than Bush so far. Must be really blackmailable or bribable (or both at once) to be this bad so soon.

Corey Mondello · 11 months ago

I believe fundamentalists like Rick Warren should have no rights...in fact, I think they are hell-bent on destroying America and the World, guilty of Treason and should be dealt with as a guilty combatant and sent to one of the many USA government funded prisons where there is no law to follow, and the inmates are destined to stay locked away with no lawyers, no family contact, one hour a day of sunlight, bound and gagged and have their bibles peed' and pooped on.

Hell, I'd be all for a raise in taxes if this were possible!!!

erik leidal · 10 months ago

I'm not just disappointed or frustrated by President-elect Obama's decision to choose Rick Warren to deliver the invocation at the inauguration. I believe it poses a danger to homosexuals and should frighten those who support their quest for equal rights under the law. In order to explain why, I will attempt to argue here in ways that seek to identify the fundamental issues at stake in the matter. If in doing so I appear to be lecturing or talking down to the reader, I ask here for sympathy. I take this matter seriously enough to have become especially concerned by journalists and fellow citizens who brush off the controversy as if those who object to Obama's decision are too easily offended, or even melodramatically distorting the matter at hand. I'm trying to ground what I have to say in facts whenever possible.

I regard Warren's views on homosexuality to be a destructive force in American cultural politics and am convinced that his perversion of the discourse regarding same-sex relationships and their legal rights should be a topic of great concern to all Americans, indeed of all citizens of the world. What's more, I think any elected official who claims to be an ally of the LGBT community (and who relies upon the support of this community for their election to office, as Obama has) should condemn Warren for his statements, or at the very least ignore him. Instead, Obama has chosen to invite this divisive figure to act as a spiritual leader of the country on January 20th (or, at least, to perform a role that is symbolic for the respect given to the authority of the church relative to our government) at this most important moment marking the beginning of his administration.

Warren is misinformed about the history of marriage as having always been defined exclusively as that between a man and a woman. The key argument he uses to justify his position -- that the Christian religion has not allowed gay marriage for 5,000 years -- was proven as false over 15 years ago. Historian John Boswell showed as early as 1980 that this was not the case; in particular his 1994 book, Same-Sex Unions in Pre-Modern Europe (his thesis can be found in Wikipedia), provides evidence that the attitude of the Christian church towards homosexuality has dramatically changed over time, and that early Christians accepted same-sex relationships on occasion. Warren's other claim -- that all religions have and presently define marriage over these 5,000 years exclusively as that between a man and a woman -- cannot stand up to any informed anthropological study. Such statements attempt to assume authority on a topic on which he shouldn't profess to be an expert, but that's neither unusual in this debate, nor is it what matters most.

What is crucial here is that Warren regards homosexual relationships as equal to forms of relationships such as incest and pedophilia. These are indeed very much illegal, because incest endangers the health of any children conceived, and pedophilia does not constitute a consentual relationship (there may also be other important reasons, but these moral problems are certainly central). Warren's comparison equates homosexuality to relationships that every reasonable person considers absolutely morally reprehensible. By doing so, in effect, he defends the right to discriminate against individuals in ways that leading constitutional scholars consider to be unconstitutional.

Warren's condemnation poses a danger to all of America, but of course particularly to homosexuals. Why I have gone to such lengths to formulate this statement here is that people have and will continue to suffer and even die from this very kind of discrimination, in the form of hate-crime. Warren's comparison harkens back to formulations like abomination, and in doing so incites violence, essentially declaring open season on the bodies of those who have chosen to enter into a relationship different from others and wish to have it legally recognized as defined so that the same legal protection under the law applies to them. (Regardless of their reason for doing so, genetics or whatever the basis for their decision, why the freedom of homosexuals to live as they wish with equal rights should not be regarded as an inalienable right in a land whose constitution is based on the separation of church and state has always escaped me.) Their very act of working to become more visible in order to demonstrate to society as a whole that they are indeed normal people worthy of equal rights (for obviously they must do something in order to gain allies, to convince others in society that homosexuals are worthy of equal rights, as they constitute such a small minority, regardless of whether it's 2 or 10% of the population) exposes them to real physical danger. Individuals continue to die from such hate crimes. Such fear can stop romance like you wouldn't believe, unless you've been there -- this is what I tend to think about when "the pursuit of happiness" is invoked, by the way. I imagine Obama's parents were there, married at a time when many did not approve of bi-racial families.

Indeed, this comparison to multi-racial relations is apt, for Warren's comparison is ultimately ideologically dehumanizing. It leads back to historical theories regarding miscegenation and Nazi theories of racial superiority. Though Warren goes out of his way to seem enlightened, his attitudes reek of "compassionate conservativism" (in an oh-so-OC way), and I regard Warren's comfortable, positive portrayals of his promixity to gays -- of course his contact with them stems from the AIDS crisis, how else? -- as self-serving. I find it reeks of the type argument "love the sinner, hate the sin" that oozes disdain and is morally superior (a convenient rhetorical position for a pastor). Be that as it may, anyone is free to profess empathy as they wish. It's up to others to decide whether pity is really at the core, and one should follow what or whom one believes in, that's the point here, the freedom of religion and thought and expression. But what's clear is that when one person's freedom endangers that of another, time out. Politics should avoid getting involved in such moral dynamics, and I think the majority of Obama voters really wanted this too.

The election of an Afro-American is truly a historic moment for the USA. Yet as a gay man, I find I've been refused a place among others who finally, for the first time, feel included as citizens able to enjoy all the rights others have. So, if you could, try to understand me for feeling profound disappointment here, and know that I truly wish I weren't raining on this parade. I feel enough guilt for spoiling the party planned for the 20th! I keep getting the invites from all the Democratic party mailing lists and their allies, and I've decided to tell them I can't attend. I supported Obama's campaign through donation of my time and money, and it's something I regret now in part, because he does not practice what he preaches when he inspires hope for all. His choice here demonstrates that no, we actually can't all get in, not all of us. I'm happy for those that can, but then at the same time, I think of the fact that Warren will also be a keynote speaker at a Martin Luther King commemorative service the day before the inauguration!Obama's decision is making big waves here, and the divisiveness is more than symbolic.

And just in case there are those who still want to ask why I can't face reality and realize we can't all get what we want all at once? Telling someone else to be patient with their quest for equal rights is exactly the point here: no one should be required to wait, or even be inconvenienced. We get to hear about Rosa Parks and her act that defied the system of oppression all the time, and then just have to understand that Obama's invitation to Warren to deliver the invocation is part of the political game? What are we getting out of this, is there so tit for tat? I'd understand if real laws were being passed, but there were no votes cast here on this decision, and there's thousands of other religious authorities to choose from in the country.

No, the decision ultimately declares that all citizens are not created equal. Bowing to the Red States on this matter isn't a compromise, it's an abandonment of principles we were led to believe were once again being regarded as self-evident. Freedom from religious tyranny, for the taxpayer, how about seeing it that way.

What a blow to the ideals of inclusion Obama's campaign professed. Yes, it's clear that not all political decisions can please all the people all the time, but this is not fair play. Choosing Warren to perform such an important role in the inauguration is inexcusable and deserves all the moral outrage it can get.

Sincerely

Erik Leidal

Irvine, CA 92612